Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:

1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.

2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia

Phelps merely filled in the gaps.

Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
and who is the strongest.

Phelps missed out on both counts.

On Aug 17, 12:54 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.

But he has perfected the art of swimming. He is the greatest in that
sense, IMO. I agree with the argument that it is easier to win
multiple medals in swimming because there are different strokes. If
it's about who is fastest, there should only be one stroke, the
fastest one. They don't have track races for running backwards, or
skipping. They don't have a relay where one guy runs, one guy skips,
one guy race walks, and one guy runs backwards. It does seem a bit
silly watching a guy swim an individual medley, knowing the same guy
can swim the same distance much faster doing crawstroke.

bringyagrogalong wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.


Pathetic troll attempt

On Aug 17, 9:17 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>
> > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> > Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> > and who is the strongest.
>
> > Phelps missed out on both counts.
>
> Pathetic troll attempt

People need to understand that B J Foster is an unabashed admirer of
the United States and anything that is remotely critical or
unflattering is immediately jumped upon with his usual venom. For
example, he went absolutely feral when it was suggested that George W
Bush was less than economical with the truth when it came to Iraq's
supposed WMD.

bringyagrogalong wrote:
> On Aug 17, 9:17 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>>
>>> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>>> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
>>> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>>> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
>>> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>>> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>>> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
>>> and who is the strongest.
>>> Phelps missed out on both counts.
>> Pathetic troll attempt
>
> People need to understand that B J Foster is an unabashed admirer of
> the United States and anything that is remotely critical or
> unflattering is immediately jumped upon with his usual venom.

8 gold medals is unprecedented, you pathetic loser.


> For
> example, he went absolutely feral when it was suggested that George W
> Bush was less than economical with the truth when it came to Iraq's
> supposed WMD.

make it up as you go, eh? Wot an arsehole

On Aug 17, 10:01 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> bringyagrogalong wrote:
> > On Aug 17, 9:17 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>
> >>> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
> >>>
> >>> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> >>> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
> >>>
> >>> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> >>> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
> >>>
> >>> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
> >>>
> >>> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> >>> and who is the strongest.
> >>>
> >>> Phelps missed out on both counts.
> >>
> >> Pathetic troll attempt
> >
> > People need to understand that B J Foster is an unabashed admirer of
> > the United States and anything that is remotely critical or
> > unflattering is immediately jumped upon with his usual venom.
>
> 8 gold medals is unprecedented, you pathetic loser.

With or without drugs?

> > For example, he went absolutely feral when it was suggested that
> > George W Bush was less than economical with the truth when it came
> > to Iraq's supposed WMD.
>
> make it up as you go, eh? Wot an arsehole

oh! And I forgot to add that Foster's a bloody racist who talks about
himself in the third person.....

"BJ Foster feels that Australia doesn't need any further immigration
(apart from a few rare skills, or family reunion and a *few*
refugees). BJ Foster is profoundly pissed off about the hordes of
quasi-migrants allowed in on temporary visas to displace Australians
from their jobs."

whoooa!! How weird is that?

"bringyagrogalong" < Okay, I get it. You're an Aussie with his green with
envy monster taking over. Pity. Maybe next time. But for now, you're just a
sore loser troll. What happened to the "great" aussie swimmers, eh? Losers,
I guess.

Pat in TX

bringyagrogalong wrote:
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.

So is the gold medalist in archery fastest, or strongest?


Bob

bringyagrogalong wrote:
> On Aug 17, 10:01 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>>> On Aug 17, 9:17 pm, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>>>>> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
>>>>> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
>>>>> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>>>>>
>>>>> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>>>>>
>>>>> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
>>>>> and who is the strongest.
>>>>>
>>>>> Phelps missed out on both counts.
>>>> Pathetic troll attempt
>>> People need to understand that B J Foster is an unabashed admirer of
>>> the United States and anything that is remotely critical or
>>> unflattering is immediately jumped upon with his usual venom.
>> 8 gold medals is unprecedented, you pathetic loser.
>
> With or without drugs?

If you weren't such a loser you would have something to back this up.


>
>>> For example, he went absolutely feral when it was suggested that
>>> George W Bush was less than economical with the truth when it came
>>> to Iraq's supposed WMD.
>> make it up as you go, eh? Wot an arsehole
>
> oh! And I forgot to add that Foster's a bloody racist who talks about
> himself in the third person.....
>
> "BJ Foster feels that Australia doesn't need any further immigration
> (apart from a few rare skills, or family reunion and a *few*
> refugees). BJ Foster is profoundly pissed off about the hordes of
> quasi-migrants allowed in on temporary visas to displace Australians
> from their jobs."
>
> whoooa!! How weird is that?
>
>

'Australians' are not a race, moron.

*plonk*

On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.

No but Phelps is the BEST at what he does.

Which is what the swimming events that he entered in the Olympic games
are all about

and Phelps won the GOLD and made a world record time in every one that
he entered.

Because he did not enter the 1500 a shithead such as yourself makes
this foolish statement.

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 03:54:29 -0700 (PDT), bringyagrogalong
<sofala@aapt.net.au> wrote:

>Phelps missed out on both counts.

Sort of like you with looks and brains, Adolf.

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 14:10:41 -0500, "Robert W. McAdams"
<rwm@fambright.com> wrote:

>bringyagrogalong wrote:
>> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
>> and who is the strongest.
>
>So is the gold medalist in archery fastest, or strongest?
>

;-)

"bringyagrogalong" (aka Serge) is certainly the dumbest.

On Aug 18, 6:18 am, B J Foster <bjfos...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> bringyagrogalong wrote:
>
> > oh! And I forgot to add that Foster's a bloody racist who talks about
> > himself in the third person.....
>
> > "BJ Foster feels that Australia doesn't need any further immigration
> > (apart from a few rare skills, or family reunion and a *few*
> > refugees).  BJ Foster is profoundly pissed off about the hordes of
> > quasi-migrants allowed in on temporary visas to displace Australians
> > from their jobs."
>
> > whoooa!!  How weird is that?
>
> 'Australians' are not a race, moron.

Didn't say that they were. Comprehension a problem?

Someone notify the game warden--this troll has already bagged his
limit.

"MW Smith" <clipper.smith@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:006e4f7a-b0dd-4d95-adc1-d6aafdec068e@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 17, 12:54 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>>
>> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
>> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>>
>> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
>> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>>
>> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>>
>> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
>> and who is the strongest.
>>
>> Phelps missed out on both counts.
>
> But he has perfected the art of swimming. He is the greatest in that
> sense, IMO. I agree with the argument that it is easier to win
> multiple medals in swimming because there are different strokes. If
> it's about who is fastest, there should only be one stroke, the
> fastest one. They don't have track races for running backwards, or
> skipping. They don't have a relay where one guy runs, one guy skips,
> one guy race walks, and one guy runs backwards. It does seem a bit
> silly watching a guy swim an individual medley, knowing the same guy
> can swim the same distance much faster doing crawstroke.

Surely in your book, Phelps has merely learned to use drugs more effectively
than anyone else.
--
Duncan Heenan

On Aug 18, 8:41 am, "Duncan Heenan" <duncanhee...@tiscali.co.uk>
wrote:
> "MW Smith" <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:006e4f7a-b0dd-4d95-adc1-d6aafdec068e@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Aug 17, 12:54 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> >> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> >> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> >> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> >> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> >> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> >> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> >> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> >> and who is the strongest.
>
> >> Phelps missed out on both counts.
>
> > But he has perfected the art of swimming. He is the greatest in that
> > sense, IMO. I agree with the argument that it is easier to win
> > multiple medals in swimming because there are different strokes. If
> > it's about who is fastest, there should only be one stroke, the
> > fastest one. They don't have track races for running backwards, or
> > skipping. They don't have a relay where one guy runs, one guy skips,
> > one guy race walks, and one guy runs backwards. It does seem a bit
> > silly watching a guy swim an individual medley, knowing the same guy
> > can swim the same distance much faster doing crawstroke.
>
> Surely in your book, Phelps has merely learned to use drugs more effectively
> than anyone else.
> --
> Duncan Heenan

As I said, I would be surprised, since he must be the most tested
athlete in the world. But not dismayed. Either way, he has perfected
the art of swimming.

On Aug 18, 2:41 am, "Duncan Heenan" <duncanhee...@tiscali.co.uk>
wrote:

> Surely in your book, Phelps has merely learned to use drugs more effectively
> than anyone else.

It's not the drugs. It's that dolphin kick.

"remysun" <remysun2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b1dc6a25-e708-4ff0-b554-d21709cfbe74@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 18, 2:41 am, "Duncan Heenan" <duncanhee...@tiscali.co.uk>
wrote:

>> Surely in your book, Phelps has merely learned to use drugs more
>> effectively
>> than anyone else.

>It's not the drugs. It's that dolphin kick.

According to MW Smith's philiosophy, Phelps (and everyone else) should be
allowed to use all the drugs they want, so that all are 'equal'.

I disagree. No swimmer or other athlete for that matter has dominated their
chosen events like Phelps. You must be Australian. Sounds like sour grapes
to me.

"bringyagrogalong" <sofala@aapt.net.au> wrote in message
news:131d37d2-0358-4696-85fd-18379e7435e7@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.

On Aug 17, 5:13 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 17, 12:54 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> > Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> > and who is the strongest.
>
> > Phelps missed out on both counts.
>
> But he has perfected the art of swimming. He is the greatest in that
> sense, IMO. I agree with the argument that it is easier to win
> multiple medals in swimming because there are different strokes. If
> it's about who is fastest, there should only be one stroke, the
> fastest one. They don't have track races for running backwards, or
> skipping. They don't have a relay where one guy runs, one guy skips,
> one guy race walks, and one guy runs backwards. It does seem a bit
> silly watching a guy swim an individual medley, knowing the same guy
> can swim the same distance much faster doing crawstroke.

the world's greatest swimmer is Lyn Cox. Diana Nyad was also pretty
amazing. Actually, I don't know who is the best. Both Cox and Nyad
were pretty amazing. Yet, Phelps has done amazing stuff.

On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia


Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.

When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
different skills.

sofala@aapt.net.au (bringyagrogalong) wrote in
news:131d37d2-0358-4696-85fd-18379e7435e7@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com:

> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.

I guess you'll need to take that up with the various sports committees
who decide how the winners are selected in all those competitions
where speed and strength aren't the sole deciding factors.

Be sure to let us know how that works out for you, OK?

--
Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN | bert@iphouse.com

On Aug 17, 11:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.

Suck it up, softcock. That American has got an armful of Olympic
golds, and you're sitting in some godawful endless suburb trolling on
the internet.

On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> different skills.

The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
squirming on your part is going to change that fact.

Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.

You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.

On Aug 20, 1:36 am, Bert Hyman <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
> sof...@aapt.net.au (bringyagrogalong) wrote innews:131d37d2-0358-4696-85fd-18379e7435e7@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> > and who is the strongest.
>
> I guess you'll need to take that up with the various sports committees
> who decide how the winners are selected in all those competitions
> where speed and strength aren't the sole deciding factors.
>
> Be sure to let us know how that works out for you, OK?

The Olympic motto is, Swifter, Higher, Stronger, so perhaps you can
take that up with the various sports committees who decide how the
winners are selected in all those competitions where speed, height and
strength aren't the sole deciding factors.

Be sure to let us know how that works out. <smirk>

On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > different skills.
>
> The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
> squirming on your part is going to change that fact.

He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.

> Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.

China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
pretty good.

On Aug 18, 5:28 am, "Duncan Heenan" <duncanhee...@tiscali.co.uk>
wrote:

> According to MW Smith's philiosophy, Phelps (and everyone else) should be
> allowed to use all the drugs they want, so that all are 'equal'.

All the drugs you could want and we'd be too stoned for any Olympics.
And that's after four years.

sofala@aapt.net.au (bringyagrogalong) wrote in news:04506135-9ed3-4197-
b87f-e0c23eb850f3@v1g2000pra.googlegroups.com:

><smirk>

Good luck.

--
Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN | bert@iphouse.com

On Aug 20, 4:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:

> The fact remains, that


The fact remains that your statement is still meaningless and
brainless. So what about at about 10 meters? Leveaux of France was
ahead of Cesar. So he must be the fastest man at the Olympics.
Tobriner of the US was ahead when they hit the water at about 2
meters. So he must be the fastest man at the Olympics.

Phelps is obviously a far more versatile swimmer than Filho, medaling
and setting records at more distances and utilizing more strokes.

> Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics.


So inaccurate as this is, as has been obvious from your first
spewings, your true motivation is to simply engage in US-slamming
trollery.

You're an armchair assclown and no amount of squirming on your part is
going to change that fact.

On Aug 20, 4:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:

> Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.


Who trains in the USA and attends and competes for Auburn University.
Everything he has in swimming he got from the USA.

Btw, every reference I find his name is listed as Cesar Cielo Filho.

On Aug 21, 2:31 am, HiC <brasspl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Aug 20, 4:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> Who trains in the USA and attends and competes for Auburn University.
> Everything he has in swimming he got from the USA.

And everything the US gymnasts have they got from China and Romania,
thanks to their Chinese and Romanian coaches.

......so your point is?

> Btw, every reference I find his name is listed as Cesar Cielo Filho.

A rose by any other name....

On Aug 20, 8:44 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> On Aug 21, 2:31 am, HiC <brasspl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 20, 4:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > Who trains in the USA and attends and competes for Auburn University.
> > Everything he has in swimming he got from the USA.
>
> And everything the US gymnasts have they got from China and Romania,
> thanks to their Chinese and Romanian coaches.


Since we're going to go veering completely off the conceptual track
and drag in things that have no bearing whatever on the point being
discussed, when America puts their best basketball players in the
Olympics everyone else looks like a Jr. high school team.

And your analogy is wrong anyway, since the American gymnasts aren't
training in Romania and China.

On Aug 21, 12:56 pm, HiC <brasspl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Aug 20, 8:44 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 21, 2:31 am, HiC <brasspl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 20, 4:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > Who trains in the USA and attends and competes for Auburn University.
> > > Everything he has in swimming he got from the USA.
>
> > And everything the US gymnasts have they got from China and Romania,
> > thanks to their Chinese and Romanian coaches.
>
> Since we're going to go veering completely off the conceptual track
> and drag in things that have no bearing whatever on the point being
> discussed, when America puts their best basketball players in the
> Olympics everyone else looks like a Jr. high school team.

True enough!

You're lucky that African-Americans are also winning your athletics
medals for you. Without them, your performance in this Olympics would
be even more abysmal.

> And your analogy is wrong anyway, since the American gymnasts aren't
> training in Romania and China.

But they are trained (which is what it's all about) by Chinese and
Romanian coaches.

On Aug 17, 8:54 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> Phelps merely filled in the gaps.
>
> Irrespective of the sport, it's always been about who is the fastest
> and who is the strongest.
>
> Phelps missed out on both counts.

No, I don't agree with that reasoning.

There's no precise standard for what 'greatest' swimmer means.

One can argue, as you have, that the swimmer who swims the fastest
over a given distance in an indoor pool is "the greatest" but then
people would disagree on what distance should be the measure. Eamonn
Sullivan holds the record in the 50 metres. But then, a lot of fifty
metres is diving and coming up, which isn't really swimming at all.
Maybe 1500 metres is the best, but then there are a lot of tumble
turns. Maybe winning a lot of races and being proficient in a lot of
different strokes is reasonable in the way that being a great dancer
might involve doing all the steps, a great communicator being a
polyglot, a great cricketer being able to bat bowl and field well or a
great mechanic working well on radically different machines would be.
Even maintaining fitness while finding the resources to do all those
races probably qualifies as 'great'.

One could argue that as pools are artificial settings, and the ice
cube especially so, that the standard should be open water. Maybe a
beach, lake or river would be more authentic. Maybe they should all
dive off the side of a barge and have to swim through open and heavy
seas to a beach wearing clothes.


It's all pretty arbitrary really.

Right now, Phelps almost certainly is the world's greatest FINA-
credentialled swimmer and certainly the most successful Olympic
particiapant, but really, who cares?

Fran

On Aug 20, 11:41 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:

> > Since we're going to go veering completely off the conceptual track
> > and drag in things that have no bearing whatever on the point being
> > discussed, when America puts their best basketball players in the
> > Olympics everyone else looks like a Jr. high school team.
>
> True enough!
>
> You're lucky that African-Americans are also winning your athletics
> medals for you. Without them, your performance in this Olympics would
> be even more abysmal.


So which is it, are the white swimmers or the black basketball players
winning "all" the US medals? I guess it would just annoy you to point
out that the US has won medals in 24 sports so far?

And if the US pulled blacks, whites, jews, catholics, anyone of
European or Asian descent, hell women, men out, they wouldn't have
squat going on in the Olympics.

You're falling farther and farther down the stupid hole.

On Aug 21, 1:52 pm, Fran <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Right now, Phelps almost certainly is the world's greatest FINA-
> credentialled swimmer and certainly the most successful Olympic
> particiapant, but really, who cares?

Who indeed!

Phelps is yesterday's news. The toast of the Olympics, and destined to
stay that way, is Usain Bolt.

On Aug 21, 3:37 pm, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
> On Aug 21, 1:52 pm, Fran <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Right now, Phelps almost certainly is the world's greatest FINA-
> > credentialled swimmer and certainly the most successful Olympic
> > particiapant, but really, who cares?
>
> Who indeed!
>
> Phelps is yesterday's news. The toast of the Olympics, and destined to
> stay that way, is Usain Bolt.

One of the guys we killed in Iraq? What did he have to do with the
Olympics?

>
> Suck it up, softcock. That American has got an armful of Olympic
> golds, and you're sitting in some godawful endless suburb trolling on
> the internet.

He's in Australia, smarting from their abysmal showing, that's all.

In 10-12 yrs, you will see China be right up there with the U.S and
Aussies in swimming. They know that is their current weakness. They
also have been pushing for more tennis. You will see many Chinese
tennis players in a few years just like the Koreans have been pushing
for the past decade on golf.

On Aug 20, 4:03 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> > > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > > different skills.
>
> > The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> > was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> > swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
> > squirming on your part is going to change that fact.
>
> He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
> about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
> define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
> support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.
>
> > Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> > 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> > they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> > You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.
>
> China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
> should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
> just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
> pretty good.

But the U.S had more medals, so it isn't about population necessarily,
but quality. The Olympics is and will be evolving over time, thus
inclusion of different sports. That is the way it is gonna be. Stuff
that might be crap to the U.S doesn't mean it is crap to the other
countries, vice-versa.

On Sep 6, 4:42 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Aug 20, 4:03 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > > > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > > > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > > > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> > > > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > > > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > > > different skills.
>
> > > The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> > > was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> > > swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
> > > squirming on your part is going to change that fact.
>
> > He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
> > about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
> > define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
> > support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.
>
> > > Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> > > 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> > > they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> > > You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.
>
> > China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
> > should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
> > just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
> > pretty good.
>
> But the U.S had more medals, so it isn't about population necessarily,
> but quality.

....and there are more quality people in a nation with a larger
population, of course.

> The Olympics is and will be evolving over time, thus
> inclusion of different sports. That is the way it is gonna be. Stuff
> that might be crap to the U.S doesn't mean it is crap to the other
> countries, vice-versa.

Crappy sport has nothing to do with what the US likes. A crappy sport
is one where judges decide who wins. It's also a crappy sport if couch
potatoes can excel at it.

On Sep 6, 6:49 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 6, 4:42 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Aug 20, 4:03 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > > > > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > > > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > > > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > > > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > > > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > > > > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > > > > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyonehas
> > > > > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > > > > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > > > > different skills.
>
> > > > The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> > > > was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> > > > swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop!  No amount of
> > > > squirming on your part is going to change that fact.
>
> > > He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
> > > about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
> > > define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
> > > support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.
>
> > > > Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> > > > 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> > > > they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> > > > You boys might as well have stayed at home.  LOL.
>
> > > China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
> > > should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
> > > just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
> > > pretty good.
>
> > But the U.S had more medals, so it isn't about population necessarily,
> > but quality.
>
> ...and there are more quality people in a nation with a larger
> population, of course.
>
> > The Olympics is and will be evolving over time, thus
> > inclusion of different sports. That is the way it is gonna be. Stuff
> > that might be crap to the U.S doesn't mean it is crap to the other
> > countries, vice-versa.
>
> Crappy sport has nothing to do with what the US likes. A crappy sport
> is one where judges decide who wins. It's also a crappy sport if couch
> potatoes can excel at it.

You are in the minority thinking gymnastics is a crappy sport. I
doubt any couch potato can do what SJohnson or Liukin did.

On Sep 6, 6:49 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 6, 6:49 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 6, 4:42 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 20, 4:03 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > > > > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > > > > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > > > > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > > > > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > > > > > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > > > > > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> > > > > > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > > > > > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > > > > > different skills.
>
> > > > > The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> > > > > was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> > > > > swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
> > > > > squirming on your part is going to change that fact.
>
> > > > He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
> > > > about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
> > > > define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
> > > > support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.
>
> > > > > Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> > > > > 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> > > > > they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> > > > > You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.
>
> > > > China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
> > > > should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
> > > > just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
> > > > pretty good.
>
> > > But the U.S had more medals, so it isn't about population necessarily,
> > > but quality.
>
> > ...and there are more quality people in a nation with a larger
> > population, of course.
>
> > > The Olympics is and will be evolving over time, thus
> > > inclusion of different sports. That is the way it is gonna be. Stuff
> > > that might be crap to the U.S doesn't mean it is crap to the other
> > > countries, vice-versa.
>
> > Crappy sport has nothing to do with what the US likes. A crappy sport
> > is one where judges decide who wins. It's also a crappy sport if couch
> > potatoes can excel at it.
>
> You are in the minority thinking gymnastics is a crappy sport. I
> doubt any couch potato can do what SJohnson or Liukin did.

You're mixing my metaphors. Did you really think I meant couch
potatoes can do gymnastics? Really?

Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.

This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.

On Sep 6, 12:33 pm, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 6, 6:49 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 6, 6:49 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 6, 4:42 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Aug 20, 4:03 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Aug 20, 10:41 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Aug 20, 1:31 am, muzicia...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Aug 17, 6:54 am, bringyagrogalong <sof...@aapt.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > Phelps is far from being the world's greatest swimmer because:
>
> > > > > > > > 1) Phelps wasn't the fastest swimmer at the Olympics, that distinction
> > > > > > > > belongs to Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil.
>
> > > > > > > > 2) Phelps wasn't the greatest long distance swimmer at the Olympics,
> > > > > > > > that distinction belongs to Mellouli Oussama of Tunisia
>
> > > > > > > Your statement is among the stupidest things ever said on Usenet.
>
> > > > > > > When one sets a record this means they've gone faster than anyone has
> > > > > > > gone before. You may have noticed that Phelps set a number of records.
> > > > > > > It's impossible to compare events at different distances. They're
> > > > > > > different skills.
>
> > > > > > The fact remains, that the fastest man at the Olympics in athletics
> > > > > > was Usain Bolt from Jamaica and the fastest man at the Olympics in
> > > > > > swimming was Cielo Filho Cesar of Brasil. Full Stop! No amount of
> > > > > > squirming on your part is going to change that fact.
>
> > > > > He was fastest over the distance of his race, but we're talking now
> > > > > about "world's greatest," not fastest for one race distance. If you
> > > > > define greatest to mean fastest over one distance, then you have to
> > > > > support that view with something besides an exclamation mark.
>
> > > > > > Incidentally, the US is having a horror Olympics. They're a whopping
> > > > > > 18 Gold Medals behind China, and if you take out Phelp's gold medals,
> > > > > > they're only 2 in front of that minnow of the Games, England.
>
> > > > > > You boys might as well have stayed at home. LOL.
>
> > > > > China has four times the population to choose athletes from, so it
> > > > > should have more medals than the US. If you throw out all the crap and
> > > > > just keep the Olympic sports, athletics and swimming, the US does
> > > > > pretty good.
>
> > > > But the U.S had more medals, so it isn't about population necessarily,
> > > > but quality.
>
> > > ...and there are more quality people in a nation with a larger
> > > population, of course.
>
> > > > The Olympics is and will be evolving over time, thus
> > > > inclusion of different sports. That is the way it is gonna be. Stuff
> > > > that might be crap to the U.S doesn't mean it is crap to the other
> > > > countries, vice-versa.
>
> > > Crappy sport has nothing to do with what the US likes. A crappy sport
> > > is one where judges decide who wins. It's also a crappy sport if couch
> > > potatoes can excel at it.
>
> > You are in the minority thinking gymnastics is a crappy sport. I
> > doubt any couch potato can do what SJohnson or Liukin did.
>
> You're mixing my metaphors. Did you really think I meant couch
> potatoes can do gymnastics? Really?
>
> Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.

There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
know.

On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith
<clipper.smith@gmail.com> wrote:
do gymnastics? Really?
>
>Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
>as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
>where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
>competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
>performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
>valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
>This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
>Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.

I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
> On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> do gymnastics? Really?
>
>
>
> >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> Dave Clary
> Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
no one will watch it. A gymnast who lands with a little hop vs.
another with a big hop after a vault is not the same. Same as a knee
bent halfway vs. a little bend. It can't be black and white. You need
a judge for this sport, that is the beauty of gymnastics. Judging will
always need improvements, but that is part of the process. For the
most part, judging in gymnastics is pretty fair. If you watch the
world championships over time, you would know. If you wanna get
picky, baseball would be considered crappy also.Different umpires have
their own strike zone and vary their strike zone inning to inning and
game to game. How fair is that? It is what it is.

On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> know.

Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.

On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > Dave Clary
> > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> no one will watch it.

We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
gymnastics.

On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > know.
>
> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.

So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
crap. Right? I'm going according to you what your definition is of a
crappy sport.

On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail..com> wrote:
>
> > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > Dave Clary
> > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > no one will watch it.
>
> We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> gymnastics.


Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil? So why did Vegas give
them a show for years? Looks like you''ve been sheltered somewhere in
Mississippi or Alabama. It is safe to say that more people watch
Cirque de Solei than they will ever watch swimming even with Phelps.
Sot does it mean swimmers usually end up working at Seaworld as
dolphin, killer whale trainers. Or they end up as lifeguards? Or your
local swim club trainers for kids? I think i'd rather be in the
crappy Cirque de Solei.

On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 14:55:58 -0700 (PDT), "zcarenow@yahoo.com"
<zcarenow@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
>> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
>> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
>> > know.
>>
>> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
>So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
>crap. Right?

Bad analogy. The bottom line in baseball is the scoreboard--how many
times someone rounds the bases and touches the plate. Sure there are
calls by umpires along the way that can affect the outcome, but it's
still about scoring runs.

Calling it crappy wouldn't be my choice of words, but any sport that
depends completely on subjective judging is a rung below sports that
use a stop watch, tape measure, or scoreboard (i.e., basketball,
baseball, etc) as a competitive event. I consider gymnast to be great
athletes (I love watching still-rings), but it's just flawed as a
competitive sport. The same goes for figure skating, diving, etc.

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 15:15:29 -0700 (PDT), "zcarenow@yahoo.com"
<zcarenow@yahoo.com> wrote:

>> We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
>> disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
>> gymnastics.
>
>
>Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil? So why did Vegas give
>them a show for years? Looks like you''ve been sheltered somewhere in
>Mississippi or Alabama. It is safe to say that more people watch
>Cirque de Solei than they will ever watch swimming even with Phelps.

UH...you need to reach over to your sarcasm detector and flip the
switch to "ON."

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Sep 7, 7:32 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
> On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 14:55:58 -0700 (PDT), "zcare...@yahoo.com"
>
> <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> >> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> >> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> >> > know.
>
> >> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> >So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> >crap. Right?
>
> Bad analogy.  The bottom line in baseball is the scoreboard--how many
> times someone rounds the bases and touches the plate.  Sure there are
> calls by umpires along the way that can affect the outcome, but it's
> still about scoring runs.
>
> Calling it crappy wouldn't be my choice of words, but any sport that
> depends completely on subjective judging is a rung below sports that
> use a stop watch, tape measure, or scoreboard (i.e., basketball,
> baseball, etc) as a competitive event.  I consider gymnast to be great
> athletes (I love watching still-rings), but it's just flawed as a
> competitive sport.  The same goes for figure skating, diving, etc.
>
> Dave Clary
> Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

Not a bad analogy if you guys want to get picky about it. Umpires can
determine an outcome of a baseball game and have so. Gymnastics,
diving, etc. have a scoring system with judging, so it isn't all
subjective. Yes, calling it crappy was a real bad choice of words.
Every sport has flaws, just the way it is. Calling gymnastics crappy
shows lack of understanding and ignorance.

On Sep 7, 11:55 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > > know.
>
> > Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> crap. Right? I'm going according to you what your definition is of a
> crappy sport.

Baseball is scored by runs, not by judges. Bowling is a crappy sport
because couch potatoes excel at it.

On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > Dave Clary
> > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > no one will watch it.
>
> > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > gymnastics.
>
> Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?

You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
here is what you said:

"Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
no one will watch it."

You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
there.

On Sep 8, 5:23 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 7:32 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 14:55:58 -0700 (PDT), "zcare...@yahoo.com"
>
> > <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > >> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > >> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > >> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > >> > know.
>
> > >> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> > >So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> > >crap. Right?
>
> > Bad analogy. The bottom line in baseball is the scoreboard--how many
> > times someone rounds the bases and touches the plate. Sure there are
> > calls by umpires along the way that can affect the outcome, but it's
> > still about scoring runs.
>
> > Calling it crappy wouldn't be my choice of words, but any sport that
> > depends completely on subjective judging is a rung below sports that
> > use a stop watch, tape measure, or scoreboard (i.e., basketball,
> > baseball, etc) as a competitive event. I consider gymnast to be great
> > athletes (I love watching still-rings), but it's just flawed as a
> > competitive sport. The same goes for figure skating, diving, etc.
>
> > Dave Clary
> > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> Not a bad analogy if you guys want to get picky about it. Umpires can
> determine an outcome of a baseball game and have so. Gymnastics,
> diving, etc. have a scoring system with judging, so it isn't all
> subjective. Yes, calling it crappy was a real bad choice of words.
> Every sport has flaws, just the way it is. Calling gymnastics crappy
> shows lack of understanding and ignorance.

If you run a gymnastics competition without judges, how do you
determine the winner?

On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or evento do
> > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best..
>
> > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > gymnastics.
>
> > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> here is what you said:
>
> "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> no one will watch it."
>
> You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

And that is the beauty of gymnastics. You have judging along with
scoring. That is why you're ignorant claiming that sports with judging
is crappy. You have missed it.

On Sep 8, 1:13 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 5:23 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 7, 7:32 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 14:55:58 -0700 (PDT), "zcare...@yahoo.com"
>
> > > <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > >> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is.. You
> > > >> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > > >> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happensyou
> > > >> > know.
>
> > > >> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> > > >So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> > > >crap. Right?
>
> > > Bad analogy.  The bottom line in baseball is the scoreboard--how many
> > > times someone rounds the bases and touches the plate.  Sure there are
> > > calls by umpires along the way that can affect the outcome, but it's
> > > still about scoring runs.
>
> > > Calling it crappy wouldn't be my choice of words, but any sport that
> > > depends completely on subjective judging is a rung below sports that
> > > use a stop watch, tape measure, or scoreboard (i.e., basketball,
> > > baseball, etc) as a competitive event.  I consider gymnast to be great
> > > athletes (I love watching still-rings), but it's just flawed as a
> > > competitive sport.  The same goes for figure skating, diving, etc.
>
> > > Dave Clary
> > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > Not a bad analogy if you guys want to get picky about it. Umpires can
> > determine an outcome of a baseball game and have so. Gymnastics,
> > diving, etc. have a scoring system with judging, so it isn't all
> > subjective. Yes, calling it crappy was a real bad choice of words.
> > Every sport has flaws, just the way it is. Calling gymnastics crappy
> > shows lack of understanding and ignorance.
>
> If you run a gymnastics competition without judges, how do you
> determine the winner?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Like i said before in previous posts, judging and scoring is the
beauty of the sport. Nothing crappy about it. Again, your ignorance
shows. You better stick to swimming since you have no clue.

On Sep 8, 1:00 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 7, 11:55 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > > > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > > > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > > > know.
>
> > > Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> > So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> > crap. Right? I'm going according to you what your definition is of a
> > crappy sport.
>
> Baseball is scored by runs, not by judges. Bowling is a crappy sport
> because couch potatoes excel at it.

Baseball is scored by runs, but umpires determine how the runs are
scored by balls and strikes. Bowling is not a crappy sport is what you
meant since there are no judges. This is according to you.

On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or evento do
> > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best..
>
> > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > gymnastics.
>
> > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> here is what you said:
>
> "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> no one will watch it."
>
> You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

The judges at cirque du soleil are the audience. If you really want to
know. I can assure you they will let others know if the show was good
or not.

On Sep 8, 7:17 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 1:13 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 5:23 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 7:32 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 14:55:58 -0700 (PDT), "zcare...@yahoo.com"
>
> > > > <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > >On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >> On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >> > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > > > >> > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > > > >> > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > > > >> > know.
>
> > > > >> Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> > > > >So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> > > > >crap. Right?
>
> > > > Bad analogy. The bottom line in baseball is the scoreboard--how many
> > > > times someone rounds the bases and touches the plate. Sure there are
> > > > calls by umpires along the way that can affect the outcome, but it's
> > > > still about scoring runs.
>
> > > > Calling it crappy wouldn't be my choice of words, but any sport that
> > > > depends completely on subjective judging is a rung below sports that
> > > > use a stop watch, tape measure, or scoreboard (i.e., basketball,
> > > > baseball, etc) as a competitive event. I consider gymnast to be great
> > > > athletes (I love watching still-rings), but it's just flawed as a
> > > > competitive sport. The same goes for figure skating, diving, etc.
>
> > > > Dave Clary
> > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > Not a bad analogy if you guys want to get picky about it. Umpires can
> > > determine an outcome of a baseball game and have so. Gymnastics,
> > > diving, etc. have a scoring system with judging, so it isn't all
> > > subjective. Yes, calling it crappy was a real bad choice of words.
> > > Every sport has flaws, just the way it is. Calling gymnastics crappy
> > > shows lack of understanding and ignorance.
>
> > If you run a gymnastics competition without judges, how do you
> > determine the winner?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Like i said before in previous posts, judging and scoring is the
> beauty of the sport. Nothing crappy about it. Again, your ignorance
> shows. You better stick to swimming since you have no clue.

So you can't answer the question? If you run a gymnastics
competition without judges, how do you
determine the winner? You can play a baseball game without umpires.
Millions of kids do it everyday. How do you run a gymnastics
competition without judges?

On Sep 8, 7:23 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 1:00 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 7, 11:55 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 5:33 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 7, 2:21 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > There will always be sports that uses judges, just the way it is. You
> > > > > might think it is crappy, but others don't. Anytime there are judges,
> > > > > it will have some subjectivity, just the way it is. Shit happens you
> > > > > know.
>
> > > > Yes, shit happens. That's what crap is you know.
>
> > > So that means you should agree Baseball is crap too. Bowling is not
> > > crap. Right? I'm going according to you what your definition is of a
> > > crappy sport.
>
> > Baseball is scored by runs, not by judges. Bowling is a crappy sport
> > because couch potatoes excel at it.
>
> Baseball is scored by runs, but umpires determine how the runs are
> scored by balls and strikes.

No, they don't. You can easily run a baseball game without umpires.
They aren't necessary, and I'm willing to bet that most baseball/
softball games are played without them.

> Bowling is not a crappy sport is what you
> meant since there are no judges. This is according to you.

No, sorry. I described two kinds of crappy sports. Bowling is of the
second kind. You can be a champion bowler even though you are obese
and can't climb a flight of stairs without huffing and puffing.

On Sep 8, 7:33 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > > gymnastics.
>
> > > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> > You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> > here is what you said:
>
> > "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > no one will watch it."
>
> > You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> > pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> > judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> > watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> > there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> The judges at cirque du soleil are the audience. If you really want to
> know. I can assure you they will let others know if the show was good
> or not.

The show is always good. You know what we mean by judges here. They
don't keep score at a Cirque du Soleil performance. You claimed judges
are required for gymnastics or no one would watch gymnastics. Your
claim is false.

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:15:06 -0700 (PDT), "zcarenow@yahoo.com"
<zcarenow@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>
>And that is the beauty of gymnastics. You have judging along with
>scoring.

Then this is definitely a case of beauty being in the eye of the
beholder. I think the judging is often a frickin' joke, and the whole
controversy around it at events takes away from the actuall
performance.

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:55:35 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith
<clipper.smith@gmail.com> wrote:

nt since there are no judges. This is according to you.
>
>No, sorry. I described two kinds of crappy sports. Bowling is of the
>second kind. You can be a champion bowler even though you are obese
>and can't climb a flight of stairs without huffing and puffing.

Welll now you're taking this off on a whole new tangent. Bowling is a
PERFECT example of your original point. Who knocked down the most
pins--that's all that matters. No judges giving style points or
deducting a few pins for a Brooklyn. As a basis for competition, it's
excellent.

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Sep 8, 12:57 pm, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 7:33 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's afact.
> > > > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > > > gymnastics.
>
> > > > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> > > You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> > > here is what you said:
>
> > > "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > no one will watch it."
>
> > > You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> > > pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> > > judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> > > watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> > > there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > The judges at cirque du soleil are the audience. If you really want to
> > know. I can assure you they will let others know if the show was good
> > or not.
>
> The show is always good. You know what we mean by judges here. They
> don't keep score at a Cirque du Soleil performance. You claimed judges
> are required for gymnastics or no one would watch gymnastics. Your
> claim is false.

There have been bad shows by Cirque de Solei. They have different
versions. Draglion is one of them. Yeah, the audience doesn't keep a
score,but others won't attend if the shows are bad. That is like
keeping score. Gymnastics is a competition, thus they want to have a
scoring and judging system. Your comparisons are stupid.

On Sep 8, 12:57 pm, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 7:33 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's afact.
> > > > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > > > gymnastics.
>
> > > > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> > > You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> > > here is what you said:
>
> > > "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > no one will watch it."
>
> > > You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> > > pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> > > judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> > > watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> > > there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > The judges at cirque du soleil are the audience. If you really want to
> > know. I can assure you they will let others know if the show was good
> > or not.
>
> The show is always good. You know what we mean by judges here. They
> don't keep score at a Cirque du Soleil performance. You claimed judges
> are required for gymnastics or no one would watch gymnastics. Your
> claim is false.

There have been bad shows by Cirque de Solei. They have different
versions. Draglion is one of them. Yeah, the audience doesn't keep a
score,but others won't attend if the shows are bad. That is like
keeping score. Gymnastics is a competition, thus they want to have a
scoring and judging system. Your comparisons are stupid.

On Sep 8, 5:55 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:15:06 -0700 (PDT), "zcare...@yahoo.com"
>
> <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >And that is the beauty of gymnastics. You have judging along with
> >scoring.
>
> Then this is definitely a case of beauty being in the eye of the
> beholder.  I think the judging is often a frickin' joke, and the whole
> controversy around it at events takes away from the actuall
> performance.  
>
> Dave Clary
> Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

Again, not liking it was one thing, but the sport itself is not crappy.

On Sep 8, 5:59 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:55:35 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith
>
> <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> nt since there are no judges. This is according to you.
>
>
>
> >No, sorry. I described two kinds of crappy sports. Bowling is of the
> >second kind. You can be a champion bowler even though you are obese
> >and can't climb a flight of stairs without huffing and puffing.
>
> Welll now you're taking this off on a whole new tangent.  Bowling is a
> PERFECT example of your original point.  Who knocked down the most
> pins--that's all that matters.  No judges giving style points or
> deducting a few pins for a Brooklyn.  As a basis for competition, it's
> excellent.
>
> Dave Clary
> Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

Let's see. He is now saying he had two different crappy
sports....lol... Your reference to obese was a joke. Now, if Bowling
is crappy cuz you can be obese....blah blah..but it can be non-crappy
since no judges are involved. So it is both a crappy and non-crappy
sport. So should i add a 3rd type of crappy sport being both crappy
and non-crappy....lol...you're fuckin' senile dude!!

Give up guys! Just admit your lack of ignorance! You guys are
incorrigible...haha

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:04:04 -0700 (PDT), "zcarenow@yahoo.com"
<zcarenow@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Give up guys! Just admit your lack of ignorance!

Ok...I fess up...I'm totally lacking in ignorance.

Is that better?

Dave Clary
Corpus Christi, TX
http://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
Diet, Exercise, and Golf!

On Sep 9, 12:59 am, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:55:35 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith
>
> <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> nt since there are no judges. This is according to you.
>
>
>
> >No, sorry. I described two kinds of crappy sports. Bowling is of the
> >second kind. You can be a champion bowler even though you are obese
> >and can't climb a flight of stairs without huffing and puffing.
>
> Welll now you're taking this off on a whole new tangent. Bowling is a
> PERFECT example of your original point. Who knocked down the most
> pins--that's all that matters. No judges giving style points or
> deducting a few pins for a Brooklyn. As a basis for competition, it's
> excellent.

I gave two requirements for a sport not to be crappy. Bowling is of
the second kind. Bowling is an excellent game and an excellent way to
compete, but as a sport, it's crappy. Nor does a sport have to be a
competition. To me, aerobics classes and spinning classes are sport,
and there is no competition there at all, no score keeping of any
kind. Technically, you can do them if you're a couch potato, but in
that case, that's WHY you're doing them. It's your attitude that's
important in determining whether your chosen activity is a sport. The
fat guy who is doing spinning classes to lose weight probably isn't
doing it as a sport. He doesn't see it that way. But after he gets in
shape and has developed the exercise habit, he might well come to see
his daily spinning or aerobics classes as sport. I do.

On Sep 9, 1:48 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 12:57 pm, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 7:33 pm, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Sep 8, 1:09 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Sep 8, 12:15 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Sep 7, 5:36 am, MW Smith <clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Sep 7, 5:55 am, "zcare...@yahoo.com" <zcare...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Sep 6, 7:52 pm, d...@geewhiz.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 10:33:25 -0700 (PDT), MW Smith<clipper.sm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > do gymnastics? Really?
>
> > > > > > > > >Gymnastics isn't a crappy thing sport to do on your own, or even to do
> > > > > > > > >as a performance for a crowd, like circus performers do, which is
> > > > > > > > >where a lot of gymnasts go after they stop competing. It is a crappy
> > > > > > > > >competitive sport because there is no objective way to compare
> > > > > > > > >performances. People disagree about who won, and the disagreements are
> > > > > > > > >valid because there is no way to test which performance was best.
>
> > > > > > > > >This has nothing to do with me being in the minority. It's a fact.
> > > > > > > > >Look what happened at this olympics in gymnastics.
>
> > > > > > > > I'll be damned--on this point we are in total agreement!!
>
> > > > > > > > Dave Clary
> > > > > > > > Corpus Christi, TXhttp://davegetsfit.blogspot.com
> > > > > > > > Diet, Exercise, and Golf!
>
> > > > > > > Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > > > > no one will watch it.
>
> > > > > > We should tell the folks at Cirque de Soleil. They will be
> > > > > > disappointed to hear no one will actually pay to watch their
> > > > > > gymnastics.
>
> > > > > Interesting.People don't watch Cirque de Soleil?
>
> > > > You claimed gymnastics must have judges or no one will watch it. See,
> > > > here is what you said:
>
> > > > "Gymnastics has to have judging to determine the best. If it didn't ,
> > > > no one will watch it."
>
> > > > You actually wrote that claim. With irony you apparently missed, I
> > > > pointed out how laughingly silly your claim is, since there are no
> > > > judges judging the gymnastics at Cirque du Soleil yet people not only
> > > > watch the gymnastics there, they pay money to watch the gymnastics
> > > > there.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > The judges at cirque du soleil are the audience. If you really want to
> > > know. I can assure you they will let others know if the show was good
> > > or not.
>
> > The show is always good. You know what we mean by judges here. They
> > don't keep score at a Cirque du Soleil performance. You claimed judges
> > are required for gymnastics or no one would watch gymnastics. Your
> > claim is false.
>
> There have been bad shows by Cirque de Solei. They have different
> versions. Draglion is one of them. Yeah, the audience doesn't keep a
> score,but others won't attend if the shows are bad. That is like
>