Team USA put together a respectable but not great team this year. There was
some earlier chatter about them being "Dream Team II". With a close call to
Australia and a few bad quarters here and there in other games, it's pretty
darned clear they are nothing of the sort.

Are other teams catching up? Sure. But that's not the main issue here,
imo. The quality of play in THIS country has been on a steady decline for
well over a decade. Consider the
'92 Real Dream Team Roster:

Barkley (leading scorer)
Mullin ( before this guy gets shrugged off, he was the 2nd leading scorer)
Bird
Magic
Jordan
Ewing
DRob
Pip
Malone
Stockton
Drexler
.....and Laettner, the college kid token

Consider that they're coach, Chuck Daly, never used a single timeout. The
average margin of victory was 44 points. The CLOSEST game was 32 points.

I'm sorry, but put THAT team in today's competition and coach K would never
need a timeout and the average margin of victory would still be well over 30
points with no close games.

Personally, as much as it would suck for the team's chance of repeating, the
Boston Celtics (a TEAM) would proabably have done better in the Olympics
than the mix we have now.

Boozer
Kidd
Lebron
Bryant
DWade
Paul
Bosh
Melo
Tayshaun
Redd
Deron
Howard

PG's - Not even worth discussing - Stockton and Magic vastly overshadow
Kidd, Paul, Wade, Deron (lots of "point guards", problem number 56)
C's - this team doesn't really have one. Not in the classic mold. Howard
is closest, but not in the same atmosphere as DRob or Ewing.
Superstar factor - Lebron is great and Kobe holds his own. Neither is
Jordan.
Monster factor - Barkley was a wrecking machine. Carlos? Can't carry
Chuck's jock strap.
Scoring guy - Clyde, the Poor Man's MJ, had such a better grasp of the game
than Melo does.
Intangible guy Bird, Pippen.... vs Tayshaun Prince??? ouch....
Shooter - Bird, Mullin, Stockton vs Redd... sigh.

I could go on, but the point is simple - while we will have our close games
and maybe (hopefully not) losses, people will continue to talk about how the
world is so much better. While that's probably true to a point, don't be so
easily fooled - the squad out there is no better than than a practice squad
to the '92 team. Our basketball has declined AND we haven't been sending
our best teams.

On Aug 6, 5:38 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Team USA put together a respectable but not great team this year.  There was
> some earlier chatter about them being "Dream Team II".  With a close call to
> Australia and a few bad quarters here and there in other games, it's pretty
> darned clear they are nothing of the sort.
>
> Are other teams catching up?  Sure.  But that's not the main issue here,
> imo.  The quality of play in THIS country has been on a steady decline for
> well over a decade.  Consider the
> '92 Real Dream Team Roster:
>
> Barkley (leading scorer)
> Mullin ( before this guy gets shrugged off, he was the 2nd leading scorer)
> Bird
> Magic
> Jordan
> Ewing
> DRob
> Pip
> Malone
> Stockton
> Drexler
> ....and Laettner, the college kid token
>
> Consider that they're coach, Chuck Daly, never used a single timeout.  The
> average margin of victory was 44 points.  The CLOSEST game was 32 points.
>
> I'm sorry, but put THAT team in today's competition and coach K would never
> need a timeout and the average margin of victory would still be well over30
> points with no close games.
>
> Personally, as much as it would suck for the team's chance of repeating, the
> Boston Celtics (a TEAM) would proabably have done better in the Olympics
> than the mix we have now.
>
> Boozer
> Kidd
> Lebron
> Bryant
> DWade
> Paul
> Bosh
> Melo
> Tayshaun
> Redd
> Deron
> Howard
>
> PG's - Not even worth discussing - Stockton and Magic vastly overshadow
> Kidd, Paul, Wade, Deron (lots of "point guards", problem number 56)
> C's - this team doesn't really have one.  Not in the classic mold.  Howard
> is closest, but not in the same atmosphere as DRob or Ewing.
> Superstar factor - Lebron is great and Kobe holds his own.  Neither is
> Jordan.
> Monster factor - Barkley was a wrecking machine.  Carlos?  Can't carry
> Chuck's jock strap.
> Scoring guy - Clyde, the Poor Man's MJ, had such a better grasp of the game
> than Melo does.
> Intangible guy Bird, Pippen.... vs Tayshaun Prince??? ouch....
> Shooter - Bird, Mullin, Stockton vs Redd... sigh.
>
> I could go on, but the point is simple - while we will have our close games
> and maybe (hopefully not) losses, people will continue to talk about how the
> world is so much better.  While that's probably true to a point, don't be so
> easily fooled - the squad out there is no better than than a practice squad
> to the '92 team.  Our basketball has declined AND we haven't been sending
> our best teams.

youre just one of these guys that always thinks the past is better
than the present because you filter out everything except the good
things and remember people better than they were.

but if you really think none of these players are as good as the past
team what does that say about the celtics since none of your teams
players even made the roster?

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f655c353-f296-42d4-8b14-c815e05f1bf7@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 6, 5:38 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Team USA put together a respectable but not great team this year. There
> was
> some earlier chatter about them being "Dream Team II". With a close call
> to
> Australia and a few bad quarters here and there in other games, it's
> pretty
> darned clear they are nothing of the sort.
>
> Are other teams catching up? Sure. But that's not the main issue here,
> imo. The quality of play in THIS country has been on a steady decline for
> well over a decade. Consider the
> '92 Real Dream Team Roster:
>
> Barkley (leading scorer)
> Mullin ( before this guy gets shrugged off, he was the 2nd leading scorer)
> Bird
> Magic
> Jordan
> Ewing
> DRob
> Pip
> Malone
> Stockton
> Drexler
> ....and Laettner, the college kid token
>
> Consider that they're coach, Chuck Daly, never used a single timeout. The
> average margin of victory was 44 points. The CLOSEST game was 32 points.
>
> I'm sorry, but put THAT team in today's competition and coach K would
> never
> need a timeout and the average margin of victory would still be well over
> 30
> points with no close games.
>
> Personally, as much as it would suck for the team's chance of repeating,
> the
> Boston Celtics (a TEAM) would proabably have done better in the Olympics
> than the mix we have now.
>
> Boozer
> Kidd
> Lebron
> Bryant
> DWade
> Paul
> Bosh
> Melo
> Tayshaun
> Redd
> Deron
> Howard
>
> PG's - Not even worth discussing - Stockton and Magic vastly overshadow
> Kidd, Paul, Wade, Deron (lots of "point guards", problem number 56)
> C's - this team doesn't really have one. Not in the classic mold. Howard
> is closest, but not in the same atmosphere as DRob or Ewing.
> Superstar factor - Lebron is great and Kobe holds his own. Neither is
> Jordan.
> Monster factor - Barkley was a wrecking machine. Carlos? Can't carry
> Chuck's jock strap.
> Scoring guy - Clyde, the Poor Man's MJ, had such a better grasp of the
> game
> than Melo does.
> Intangible guy Bird, Pippen.... vs Tayshaun Prince??? ouch....
> Shooter - Bird, Mullin, Stockton vs Redd... sigh.
>
> I could go on, but the point is simple - while we will have our close
> games
> and maybe (hopefully not) losses, people will continue to talk about how
> the
> world is so much better. While that's probably true to a point, don't be
> so
> easily fooled - the squad out there is no better than than a practice
> squad
> to the '92 team. Our basketball has declined AND we haven't been sending
> our best teams.

youre just one of these guys that always thinks the past is better
than the present because you filter out everything except the good
things and remember people better than they were.

but if you really think none of these players are as good as the past
team what does that say about the celtics since none of your teams
players even made the roster?

**********************************************************

Hi again Laker Troll.

It says nothing about the Celtics. KG would have been welcomed with open
arms but declined to play. The trifecta of KG/PP/RA would have been a
fabulous starting point for the US Olympic Team.

Read the above post Mr. Skim Reader. I didn't say "none of these players
are as good". I said the team was not as good and the current players are
not, overall, nearly as talented. Lebron and Kobe will be the two "stars"
you will point to, and I admit they are great players. But neither is
Jordan and as a team it falls pitifully far behind the '92 team (which had
one Laker and one Celtic by the way).

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f655c353-f296-42d4-8b14-c815e05f1bf7@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...

Hey Loser2009. this USA Olympic is going to have problems because Kobe
sucks. If KG were on the team, he would be the one the other plays took
their cue from and they'd beat everyone by 40 because they do have enough
talent to. And to answer your stupid question before you have to ask it and
make yourself look stupid, the answer is:

1) Because he commands that kind of respect, and
2) That is EXACTLY what he did for the C's.

Which is why the C's were Champions and the Lakers not.

Point in fact is that every player on the original Dream Team knew the game
better and took it more seriously than everyone except perhaps two players
on this current Olympic squad. For your information, none of the two
players is named Kobe. Kobe is an overrated, overhyped, MJ wannabee. He's
been so since his first HS game and continues to be to this day.

Who knows, maybe it's all part of a plan to equalize basketball all around
the world. It's genius! Hype that asswipe Kobe and ruin basketball
fundamentals all over the world. That's what happened a generation ago when
they focused on MJ day and night. A whole generation of players wanted to
dunk, and in the process forgot how to do the OTHER THINGS like shoot, pass,
dribble and rebound. Ruin the game the world over and then the best
athletes in the world, the USA, will have a shot again.

Until they are no longer the best athletes in the world...then they'll have
to think of something else.

The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team by
about 20 points, every night, easily.

In article <g7lmlv02gnl@news1.newsguy.com>,
"Robert Chin" <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:

> <lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:f655c353-f296-42d4-8b14-c815e05f1bf7@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>
> Hey Loser2009. this USA Olympic is going to have problems because Kobe
> sucks. If KG were on the team, he would be the one the other plays took
> their cue from and they'd beat everyone by 40 because they do have enough
> talent to. And to answer your stupid question before you have to ask it and
> make yourself look stupid, the answer is:
>
> 1) Because he commands that kind of respect, and
> 2) That is EXACTLY what he did for the C's.
>
> Which is why the C's were Champions and the Lakers not.
>
> Point in fact is that every player on the original Dream Team knew the game
> better and took it more seriously than everyone except perhaps two players
> on this current Olympic squad. For your information, none of the two
> players is named Kobe. Kobe is an overrated, overhyped, MJ wannabee. He's
> been so since his first HS game and continues to be to this day.
>
> Who knows, maybe it's all part of a plan to equalize basketball all around
> the world. It's genius! Hype that asswipe Kobe and ruin basketball
> fundamentals all over the world. That's what happened a generation ago when
> they focused on MJ day and night. A whole generation of players wanted to
> dunk, and in the process forgot how to do the OTHER THINGS like shoot, pass,
> dribble and rebound. Ruin the game the world over and then the best
> athletes in the world, the USA, will have a shot again.
>
> Until they are no longer the best athletes in the world...then they'll have
> to think of something else.
>
> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team by
> about 20 points, every night, easily.

How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
--

"That's why i don't eat shrimp!"

"hebok#8" <hebok@staples.com> wrote in message
news:hebok-E590ED.23402509082008@newsgroups.comcast.net...

How stupid of you. Need me to spell it out? Kobe Bryant is to basketball
what Britney Spears is to music.

On Aug 9, 8:17 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:f655c353-f296-42d4-8b14-c815e05f1bf7@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>
> Hey Loser2009. this USA Olympic is going to have problems because Kobe
> sucks.  If KG were on the team, he would be the one the other plays took
> their cue from and they'd beat everyone by 40 because they do have enough
> talent to.  And to answer your stupid question before you have to ask it and
> make yourself look stupid, the answer is:
>
> 1)  Because he commands that kind of respect, and
> 2)  That is EXACTLY what he did for the C's.
>
> Which is why the C's were Champions and the Lakers not.
>
> Point in fact is that every player on the original Dream Team knew the game
> better and took it more seriously than everyone except perhaps two players
> on this current Olympic squad.  For your information, none of the two
> players is named Kobe.  Kobe is an overrated, overhyped, MJ wannabee.  He's
> been so since his first HS game and continues to be to this day.
>
> Who knows, maybe it's all part of a plan to equalize basketball all around
> the world.  It's genius!  Hype that asswipe Kobe and ruin basketball
> fundamentals all over the world.  That's what happened a generation agowhen
> they focused on MJ day and night.  A whole generation of players wantedto
> dunk, and in the process forgot how to do the OTHER THINGS like shoot, pass,
> dribble and rebound.  Ruin the game the world over and then the best
> athletes in the world, the USA, will have a shot again.
>
> Until they are no longer the best athletes in the world...then they'll have
> to think of something else.
>
> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team by
> about 20 points, every night, easily.

you should have just typed "im a kobe hater." less words.

On Aug 9, 9:31 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "hebok#8" <he...@staples.com> wrote in message
>
> news:hebok-E590ED.23402509082008@newsgroups.comcast.net...
>
> How stupid of you. Need me to spell it out?  Kobe Bryant is to basketball
> what Britney Spears is to music.

you are to basketball fandom what sigfried is to roy.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b8690357-dd83-4074-800d-c747de17d7af@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...

Coming from a Loser like you...who gives shit. Take your cup and go sit
outside a bus station loser.

On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:b8690357-dd83-4074-800d-c747de17d7af@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
>
> Coming from a Loser like you...who gives shit.  Take your cup and go sit
> outside a bus station loser.

the dream team will win every game because they dont have any smeltics
on it. enjoy your bought championship you will not win another one for
many many many years if at all.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:

WOW...what a crappy game by the "best" player in his own and LA medias mind.
Too bad for your deluded mind that everyone else knows that Lebron is the
best player in the world. Now that the games count, Lebron is putting on a
show all at both ends of the court. So is Dwayne Wade. Kobe might have
been the 4th or 5th best player for the US today. Maybe

Team USA replaced Kobe with KG, they'd have been up 40 at the half and won
by 67 points dressing coach K and some of his assistants for the last 5
minutes.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:

I can't wait until Kobe takes 50 mill to play in Italy.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

On Aug 10, 11:02 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> WOW...what a crappy game by the "best" player in his own and LA medias mind.

taking one game out of context is typical robert ballsack chin. if
kobe would have been the top scorer you would have said hes not a team
player. because you are a hater.

> Team USA replaced Kobe with KG, they'd have been up 40 at the half and won
> by 67 points dressing coach K and some of his assistants for the last 5
> minutes.

well since kg (and no other smeltics) were good enough to make the
team we will never know how he would have done. we only have your
delusional prediction. i kinda wish paul pierced would have been good
enough to make the team because it would have been fun watching him
being wheeled up to get the gold medal in his wheel chair and throwing
up gang signs in the awards ceremony.

On Aug 10, 11:03 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I can't wait until Kobe takes 50 mill to play in Italy.

still wouldnt help the c's chances of repeating next year. besides
your team wont even make it into the finals. they will be knocked out
by another leastern conference team.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bd137bb4-5a8f-4b1e-8df8-8cecd7a4d41a@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 10, 11:02 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> WOW...what a crappy game by the "best" player in his own and LA medias
> mind.

taking one game out of context is typical robert ballsack chin. if
kobe would have been the top scorer you would have said hes not a team
player. because you are a hater.

> Team USA replaced Kobe with KG, they'd have been up 40 at the half and won
> by 67 points dressing coach K and some of his assistants for the last 5
> minutes.

well since kg (and no other smeltics) were good enough to make the
team we will never know how he would have done. we only have your
delusional prediction. i kinda wish paul pierced would have been good
enough to make the team because it would have been fun watching him
being wheeled up to get the gold medal in his wheel chair and throwing
up gang signs in the awards ceremony.

***********************************************************

What may seem obvious to most of us seems to have escaped you. The more you
[unsuccessfully] attempt to belittle the Celtics, the louder you are stating
that your Lakers were/are a terrible team.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6e6c7c14-30bb-4191-83fc-e0e575de83df@j33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 10, 11:03 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I can't wait until Kobe takes 50 mill to play in Italy.

still wouldnt help the c's chances of repeating next year. besides
your team wont even make it into the finals. they will be knocked out
by another leastern conference team.

************************************************************

Bla bla bla... disc is skipping....

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bd137bb4-5a8f-4b1e-8df8-8cecd7a4d41a@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 10, 11:02 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:751bb66a-7cfa-4727-b409-ae4cdaf517b8@v26g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 9, 10:22 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> WOW...what a crappy game by the "best" player in his own and LA medias
> mind.

taking one game out of context is typical robert ballsack chin. if
kobe would have been the top scorer you would have said hes not a team
player. because you are a hater.

I love basketball and hate Fakers. Kobe is the ultimate fraud. BTW: He's
playing hte same way he always does. That's why the Lakers lost and Team
USA looks bad when he's on the floor.

Kobe is Dominique Wilkins with LESS talent

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6e6c7c14-30bb-4191-83fc-e0e575de83df@j33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 10, 11:03 am, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

You should be worried about your own team should Kobe decide to take up the
pasta diet. Can you say LOTTERY TEAM?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Ciao!

hebok#8 wrote:
> In article <g7lmlv02gnl@news1.newsguy.com>,
> "Robert Chin" <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team by
>> about 20 points, every night, easily.
>
> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.

We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two weeks.

Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the gap
between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from 41
points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent in
2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004.

This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
more international talent. And it neglects any further world improvement
between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.

So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32 points
per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much a
low-ball estimate.

The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than their
1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the "letup in
a blowout" factor).

Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32 point
underestimate above, but ballpark).

This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
(easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier to
work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.

If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even close
on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.

As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.



My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the 1992
team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the order
of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in a one
game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as some of
the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his former self
and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is at or entering
their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic, amazingly competitive
game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs prime Jordan?

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good
of its victims may be the most oppressive." -- C.S. Lewis

lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Aug 9, 9:31 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "hebok#8" <he...@staples.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:hebok-E590ED.23402509082008@newsgroups.comcast.net...
>>
>> How stupid of you. Need me to spell it out? Kobe Bryant is to basketball
>> what Britney Spears is to music.
>
> you are to basketball fandom what sigfried is to roy.

And Chin is to basketball analysis what Roy was to that tiger Montecore.

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good
of its victims may be the most oppressive." -- C.S. Lewis

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g7qit4$bq2$2@registered.motzarella.org...

And the Lamers fans and the season were what came out a day later.

BC

- yeah, I called you all a piece shit...

On Aug 11, 4:44 pm, Gary Collard <d...@ddd.com> wrote:
> lakerswin2...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > On Aug 9, 9:31 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> "hebok#8" <he...@staples.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:hebok-E590ED.23402509082008@newsgroups.comcast.net...
>
> >> How stupid of you. Need me to spell it out?  Kobe Bryant is to basketball
> >> what Britney Spears is to music.
>
> > you are to basketball fandom what sigfried is to roy.
>
> And Chin is to basketball analysis what Roy was to that tiger Montecore.

lol

On Aug 11, 7:43 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>
> news:g7qit4$bq2$2@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> And the Lamers fans and the season were what came out a day later.
>
> BC
>
> - yeah, I called you all a piece shit...

plonk

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> hebok#8 wrote:
>> In article <g7lmlv02gnl@news1.newsguy.com>,
>> "Robert Chin" <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
>>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team
>>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>>
>> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>
> We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two
> weeks.
>
> Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the gap
> between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from 41
> points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent in
> 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004.
>
> This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
> pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
> infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
> more international talent. And it neglects any further world improvement
> between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>
> So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32 points
> per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much a
> low-ball estimate.
>
> The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
> their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
> "letup in a blowout" factor).
>
> Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
> this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32 point
> underestimate above, but ballpark).
>
> This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
> (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
> Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
> i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier
> to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>
> If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even close
> on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>
> As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>
>
>
> My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the 1992
> team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
> order of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in a
> one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
> some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
> former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is at
> or entering their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic, amazingly
> competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
> prime Jordan?

That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in a
very long time. When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state you
will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to the
1992 Dream Team. The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a clue.

On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>
> news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
>
>
>
>
> > hebok#8 wrote:
> >> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
> >>  "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team
> >>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>
> >> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>
> > We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two
> > weeks.
>
> > Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the gap
> > between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from41
> > points in 1992 to 9 in 2004.  Put another way, the average US opponent in
> > 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004..
>
> > This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
> > pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
> > infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
> > more international talent.  And it neglects any further world improvement
> > between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>
> > So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32 points
> > per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very mucha
> > low-ball estimate.
>
> > The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
> > their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
> > "letup in a blowout" factor).
>
> > Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
> > this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32 point
> > underestimate above, but ballpark).
>
> > This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
> > (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
> > Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
> > i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin.  Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier
> > to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>
> > If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even close
> > on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>
> > As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>
> > My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the 1992
> > team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
> > order of a couple of points per game.  The 1992 team would do better in a
> > one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
> > some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
> > former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is at
> > or entering their primes.  It would be an entertaining, titanic, amazingly
> > competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
> > prime Jordan?
>
> That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in a
> very long time.  When you move your eyes from a closed to an open stateyou
> will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to the
> 1992 Dream Team.  The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a clue.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
"Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
thrown around. The fact is, you *can't* tell which team is better with
any degree of certainty (or, how much better 92 was than 04), so at
least apply some math to try to work it out. It's easy to look at the
rosters and see the who's who of all-time-greats on 92, but I agree
that Bird and Magic were at the ends of their careers and I won't even
go into the addition of Laettner. Boston fans can hate all they want
on Kobe Bryant, but anyone who denies his talent is showing their
obvious bias and making their argument invalid. In addition, taking
the point differential in the games at face value is ignoring the
obvious and dramatic improvement in the world's basketball talent.

And yes, I think 92 was the better team, but I appreciate the attempt
to rationalize it - and the thought of watching 92 versus 04 is
fantastic.

On Aug 12, 5:34 am, kenzaburo <James.B.Reyno...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> > > hebok#8 wrote:
> > >> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
> > >>  "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > >>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team
> > >>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>
> > >> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>
> > > We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two
> > > weeks.
>
> > > Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that thegap
> > > between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from 41
> > > points in 1992 to 9 in 2004.  Put another way, the average US opponent in
> > > 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004.
>
> > > This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
> > > pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
> > > infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
> > > more international talent.  And it neglects any further world improvement
> > > between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>
> > > So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32 points
> > > per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much a
> > > low-ball estimate.
>
> > > The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
> > > their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
> > > "letup in a blowout" factor).
>
> > > Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
> > > this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32 point
> > > underestimate above, but ballpark).
>
> > > This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
> > > (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
> > > Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
> > > i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin.  Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier
> > > to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>
> > > If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even close
> > > on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>
> > > As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>
> > > My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the 1992
> > > team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
> > > order of a couple of points per game.  The 1992 team would do better in a
> > > one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
> > > some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
> > > former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team isat
> > > or entering their primes.  It would be an entertaining, titanic, amazingly
> > > competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
> > > prime Jordan?
>
> > That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen ina
> > very long time.  When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state you
> > will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to the
> > 1992 Dream Team.  The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with aclue.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
> "Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
> thrown around. The fact is, you *can't* tell which team is better with
> any degree of certainty (or, how much better 92 was than 04), so at
> least apply some math to try to work it out. It's easy to look at the
> rosters and see the who's who of all-time-greats on 92, but I agree
> that Bird and Magic were at the ends of their careers and I won't even
> go into the addition of Laettner. Boston fans can hate all they want
> on Kobe Bryant, but anyone who denies his talent is showing their
> obvious bias and making their argument invalid. In addition, taking
> the point differential in the games at face value is ignoring the
> obvious and dramatic improvement in the world's basketball talent.
>
> And yes, I think 92 was the better team, but I appreciate the attempt
> to rationalize it - and the thought of watching 92 versus 04 is
> fantastic

great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
mercenaries were good enough to make the team.

kenzaburo wrote:
> On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> hebok#8 wrote:
>>>> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
>>>> "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team
>>>>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>>>> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>>> We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two
>>> weeks.
>>> Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the gap
>>> between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from 41
>>> points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent in
>>> 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004.
>>> This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
>>> pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
>>> infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
>>> more international talent. And it neglects any further world improvement
>>> between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>>> So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32 points
>>> per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much a
>>> low-ball estimate.
>>> The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
>>> their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
>>> "letup in a blowout" factor).
>>> Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
>>> this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32 point
>>> underestimate above, but ballpark).
>>> This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
>>> (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
>>> Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
>>> i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier
>>> to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>>> If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even close
>>> on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>>> As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>>> My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the 1992
>>> team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
>>> order of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in a
>>> one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
>>> some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
>>> former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is at
>>> or entering their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic, amazingly
>>> competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
>>> prime Jordan?
>> That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in a
>> very long time. When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state you
>> will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to the
>> 1992 Dream Team. The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a clue.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
> "Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
> thrown around.

And that's all "Skeptic" is offering, he's proven that he has no
understanding of the game at all. But I still thank him for his opinion
that the 2008 Lakers defense was superior to any of the 60's Celtics defenses.

Looking at it purely subjectively, the 92 team had the best player in
Jordan, but the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best players come from the 08 team (James,
Bryant and Wade in some permutation). The worst player is, by far,
Laettner on the 92 team (not his fault, they wanted a college guy and did
not take Shaq for whatever reason). Each team had a fading superstar
(Johnson, Kidd) and the 92 team had a finished superstar (Bird).

As the 08 team looks a little stronger at the top and bottom of the roster,
the 92 team looks a little stronger in the middle of the roster.

Each team has about 10 Hall of Fame caliber players in various stages of
their careers.

The more you look at it, the only advantage the 92 team really has is
experience, in particular championship experience, and I think that is just
enough to justify calling them the better team. But it is excruciatingly
close, most of the argument in shallower waters such as Usenet and popular
message boards comes down to an appeal to Good Old Days Syndrome.

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good
of its victims may be the most oppressive." -- C.S. Lewis

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g7sm13$2rd$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> And that's all "Skeptic" is offering, he's proven that he has no
> understanding of the game at all. But I still thank him for his opinion
> that the 2008 Lakers defense was superior to any of the 60's Celtics
> defenses.
>
> Looking at it purely subjectively, the 92 team had the best player in
> Jordan, but the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best players come from the 08 team
> (James, Bryant and Wade in some permutation). The worst player is, by
> far, Laettner on the 92 team (not his fault, they wanted a college guy and
> did not take Shaq for whatever reason). Each team had a fading superstar
> (Johnson, Kidd) and the 92 team had a finished superstar (Bird).
>
> As the 08 team looks a little stronger at the top and bottom of the
> roster, the 92 team looks a little stronger in the middle of the roster.
>
> Each team has about 10 Hall of Fame caliber players in various stages of
> their careers.
>
> The more you look at it, the only advantage the 92 team really has is
> experience, in particular championship experience, and I think that is
> just enough to justify calling them the better team. But it is
> excruciatingly close, most of the argument in shallower waters such as
> Usenet and popular message boards comes down to an appeal to Good Old Days
> Syndrome.

The '92 had a substantial edge in bigs. They had two legit hall of fame
centers in their primes (Ewing and Robinson) and two top-five all-time PF's
in their primes (Barkley and Malone). The '08 team has only one true center
(Howard, who is physically gifted but raw in terms of skills) and two
good-but-not-great PFs (Bosh and Boozer).

>"kenzaburo" <James.B.Reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:999204d5-bee3-4a71-8d28-
>But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
>"Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!"


I only said Kobe sucks. Lebron and Wade are the only two players in the
current Olympic squad that could have played on the 1992 squad.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...

> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.

Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.

Point 2: The "Greatest Player in the World" has sucked through the
exhibitions leading up to the games, and through the first two games, having
been THROUGHLY outplayed by Lebron and Wade. Kobe is overrated. I would
take a Dominique Wilkins in his prime over Kobe in his.

Stop trying so hard to be ignorant.

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g7sm13$2rd$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> Looking at it purely subjectively, the 92 team had the best player in
> Jordan, but the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best players come from the 08 team
> (James, Bryant and Wade in some permutation).

STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!

THIS IS WHY LAKERS FANS CAN NOT BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY.

YOU THINK BRYANT IS ONE OF THE THREE OR FOUR BEST PLAYERS OUT OF ALL THE
PLAYERS ON THIS AND THE 1992 TEAM?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! OVER BIRD, MAGIC AND BARKLEY?

BRYANT ISN'T EVEN THE THIRD BEST ON THIS OLYMPIC TEAM!!!! TAKE YOUR
MEDS!!!!!

In article <g7ssn001c67@news1.newsguy.com>,
Robert Chin <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
><lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>
>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>
>Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.

Point 2: KG and Ray have gold medals.

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>
> > great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
> > fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
> > mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>
> Point1:  KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
> C's.  Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.

hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.

> Point 2:  The "Greatest Player in the World" has sucked through the
> exhibitions leading up to the games, and through the first two games, having
> been THROUGHLY outplayed by Lebron and Wade.  

they are on the same team. it is team basketball. hes a team player.
kobe has proven that at any time he can score 50 points. if he were
doing that now youd hate on him for that. you are blinded by your
hate. that and your total lack of understanding anything about
basketball.

>Kobe is overrated.  I would
> take a Dominique Wilkins in his prime over Kobe in his.

keep throwing up comparisons that have no way to be tested. it is the
house of cards you build all of your stupid posts on. your jealousy of
kobe is reaching new levels of mindfuckedness.

plonk
>
> Stop trying so hard to be ignorant.

On Aug 12, 2:11 pm, durr...@innocence.com (Bryant Durrell) wrote:
> In article <g7ssn001...@news1.newsguy.com>,
>
> Robert Chin <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ><lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>
> >> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
> >> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
> >> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>
> >Point1:  KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning withthe
> >C's.  Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>
> Point 2: KG and Ray have gold medals.  

what does that have to do with anything? thats like saying that if an
nba player gets one ring he doesnt care about winning another one.
besides the players on dream team are not just playing for a gold
medal they are playing for the pride of the country.

"kenzaburo" <James.B.Reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:999204d5-bee3-4a71-8d28-c097ab820994@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>
> news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
>
>
>
>
> > hebok#8 wrote:
> >> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
> >> "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball team
> >>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>
> >> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>
> > We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in two
> > weeks.
>
> > Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the
> > gap
> > between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from
> > 41
> > points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent in
> > 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in 2004.
>
> > This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
> > pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to the
> > infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
> > more international talent. And it neglects any further world improvement
> > between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>
> > So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32
> > points
> > per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much
> > a
> > low-ball estimate.
>
> > The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
> > their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
> > "letup in a blowout" factor).
>
> > Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
> > this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32
> > point
> > underestimate above, but ballpark).
>
> > This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
> > (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this year's
> > Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it scores,
> > i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily" qualifier
> > to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>
> > If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even
> > close
> > on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>
> > As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>
> > My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the
> > 1992
> > team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
> > order of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in a
> > one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
> > some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
> > former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is at
> > or entering their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic,
> > amazingly
> > competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
> > prime Jordan?
>
> That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in a
> very long time. When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state you
> will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to the
> 1992 Dream Team. The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a
> clue.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
"Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
thrown around. The fact is, you *can't* tell which team is better with
any degree of certainty (or, how much better 92 was than 04), so at
least apply some math to try to work it out. It's easy to look at the
rosters and see the who's who of all-time-greats on 92, but I agree
that Bird and Magic were at the ends of their careers and I won't even
go into the addition of Laettner. Boston fans can hate all they want
on Kobe Bryant, but anyone who denies his talent is showing their
obvious bias and making their argument invalid. In addition, taking
the point differential in the games at face value is ignoring the
obvious and dramatic improvement in the world's basketball talent.

And yes, I think 92 was the better team, but I appreciate the attempt
to rationalize it - and the thought of watching 92 versus 04 is
fantastic.

*************************************************

Oh, I've provided rational, logical, fact based arguments for it, included
stats, previously. But it really doesn't need any of that. A simple read
of the rosters by anyone who actually watched the NBA now and then is all
that is necessary. The current team, while a very good team, completely
pales in comparison. 1992 is not so long as to not be able to compare them
head to head. In a seven game series, the '92 Dream Team sweeps the '08
Redeem team 4-0.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 12, 5:34 am, kenzaburo <James.B.Reyno...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> > > hebok#8 wrote:
> > >> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
> > >> "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > >>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball
> > >>> team
> > >>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>
> > >> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>
> > > We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in
> > > two
> > > weeks.
>
> > > Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the
> > > gap
> > > between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped
> > > from 41
> > > points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent
> > > in
> > > 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in
> > > 2004.
>
> > > This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
> > > pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to
> > > the
> > > infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees
> > > and
> > > more international talent. And it neglects any further world
> > > improvement
> > > between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>
> > > So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32
> > > points
> > > per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very
> > > much a
> > > low-ball estimate.
>
> > > The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
> > > their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly
> > > the
> > > "letup in a blowout" factor).
>
> > > Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games
> > > in
> > > this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32
> > > point
> > > underestimate above, but ballpark).
>
> > > This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
> > > (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this
> > > year's
> > > Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it
> > > scores,
> > > i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily"
> > > qualifier
> > > to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>
> > > If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even
> > > close
> > > on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>
> > > As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>
> > > My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the
> > > 1992
> > > team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
> > > order of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in
> > > a
> > > one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers,
> > > as
> > > some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of
> > > his
> > > former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is
> > > at
> > > or entering their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic,
> > > amazingly
> > > competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
> > > prime Jordan?
>
> > That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in
> > a
> > very long time. When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state
> > you
> > will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to
> > the
> > 1992 Dream Team. The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a
> > clue.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
> "Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
> thrown around. The fact is, you *can't* tell which team is better with
> any degree of certainty (or, how much better 92 was than 04), so at
> least apply some math to try to work it out. It's easy to look at the
> rosters and see the who's who of all-time-greats on 92, but I agree
> that Bird and Magic were at the ends of their careers and I won't even
> go into the addition of Laettner. Boston fans can hate all they want
> on Kobe Bryant, but anyone who denies his talent is showing their
> obvious bias and making their argument invalid. In addition, taking
> the point differential in the games at face value is ignoring the
> obvious and dramatic improvement in the world's basketball talent.
>
> And yes, I think 92 was the better team, but I appreciate the attempt
> to rationalize it - and the thought of watching 92 versus 04 is
> fantastic

great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
mercenaries were good enough to make the team.

*************************************************

Fact: KG declined an offer.
Fact: LA had more "mercenaries" than Boston by my definition - overseas
imports. By the way, hope your new Chinese recruit works out for you. Soon
Kobe will be your only domestic player.
Fact: This thread is not about putting down the current team. It's about
understanding the true greatness of the real Dream Team.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1e126264-c25b-41f0-86ce-eb4f03116489@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> keep throwing up comparisons that have no way to be tested. it is the
> house of cards you build all of your stupid posts on. your jealousy of
> kobe is reaching new levels of mindfuckedness.

Hey Stupid...it's not "jealousy". The word is "despise". As a basketball
fan, I admire his talents and despise his attitude and game.

As for "mindfucked", that would be your picture next to the entry for it in
the dictionary. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1e126264-c25b-41f0-86ce-eb4f03116489@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.

Fact is, KG was invited and said "NO". BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Why should
anyone bother you telling truth. YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!! NEITHER
COULD THE LAKERS!!!! GET IT!? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

On Aug 12, 4:41 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >"kenzaburo" <James.B.Reyno...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:999204d5-bee3-4a71-8d28-
> >But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
> >"Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!"
>
> I only said Kobe sucks.  Lebron and Wade are the only two players in the
> current Olympic squad that could have played on the 1992 squad.

Again, I can't take this seriously. Do you really think that Christian
Laettner > Kobe Bryant? If you tell me it's because of your deep-
rooted Boston hatred of all things Laker, I can go along with that...
But subjectively, you really think that Kobe Bryant couldn't have
played on the 92 team over Chris Mullin? Or a 36 year old Larry Bird?

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g7sm13$2rd$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> kenzaburo wrote:
>> On Aug 12, 7:35 am, "Skeptic" <bcs0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> "Gary Collard" <d...@ddd.com> wrote in message
>>>
>>> news:g7qiol$bq2$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> hebok#8 wrote:
>>>>> In article <g7lmlv02...@news1.newsguy.com>,
>>>>> "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>> The original Dream Team would embarass the 2008 USA Olympic bball
>>>>>> team
>>>>>> by about 20 points, every night, easily.
>>>>> How original, Kobe hate mail disguised as USA team hate mail.
>>>> We will have an estimate of how right or wrong this bold claim is in
>>>> two
>>>> weeks.
>>>> Dean Oliver's research (http://82games.com/comm52.htm) shows that the
>>>> gap
>>>> between an average NBA team and the average world opponent dropped from
>>>> 41
>>>> points in 1992 to 9 in 2004. Put another way, the average US opponent
>>>> in
>>>> 2004 was 32 points per game better than the average US opponent in
>>>> 2004.
>>>> This almost certainly understates the world improvement, since the NBA
>>>> pretty much has to have gotten stronger between 1992 and 2004 due to
>>>> the
>>>> infusion of extra talent in the form of more early entrant draftees and
>>>> more international talent. And it neglects any further world
>>>> improvement
>>>> between 2004 and 2008, although that should be slowing by now.
>>>> So let's just use that figure of the world teams having improved 32
>>>> points
>>>> per game between 1992 and today, while realizing that that is very much
>>>> a
>>>> low-ball estimate.
>>>> The same analysis shows that the Dream Team was 52 points better than
>>>> their 1992 opponents (they only won by 44, the difference is mostly the
>>>> "letup in a blowout" factor).
>>>> Thus the Dream Team would be expected to average winning their games in
>>>> this Olympics by an average of 20 ppg (an overestimate due to the 32
>>>> point
>>>> underestimate above, but ballpark).
>>>> This means, for Chin's claim that the Dream Team is 20 points better
>>>> (easily!) than the 2008 team to have any credibility at all, this
>>>> year's
>>>> Olympic team should end up allowing roughly as many points as it
>>>> scores,
>>>> i.e. has a 0 average scoring margin. Indeed, for his "easily"
>>>> qualifier
>>>> to work at all this year's team has to be outscored, bottom line.
>>>> If this year's team wins its games by double digits or anything even
>>>> close
>>>> on average, Chin's statement will be exposed as hoops idiocy.
>>>> As my gambling mentor would say, all we can do now is...let 'em play.
>>>> My own educated guess is that this team is better than any since the
>>>> 1992
>>>> team but that the 1992 team was better by a very small margin, on the
>>>> order of a couple of points per game. The 1992 team would do better in
>>>> a
>>>> one game setting than in a 7 game series if they played the 2008ers, as
>>>> some of the guys had some age on them by then (Magic was a shell of his
>>>> former self and Bird was done, in particular) and this year's team is
>>>> at
>>>> or entering their primes. It would be an entertaining, titanic,
>>>> amazingly
>>>> competitive game/series in any case...can you imagine prime LeBron vs
>>>> prime Jordan?
>>> That is the most convoluted bunch of nonsensical gibberish I've seen in
>>> a
>>> very long time. When you move your eyes from a closed to an open state
>>> you
>>> will immediately see that the this current team is vastly inferior to
>>> the
>>> 1992 Dream Team. The difference is vast and obvious to anyone with a
>>> clue.- Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
>> "Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!" argument being
>> thrown around.
>
> And that's all "Skeptic" is offering, he's proven that he has no
> understanding of the game at all. But I still thank him for his opinion
> that the 2008 Lakers defense was superior to any of the 60's Celtics
> defenses.

Era is too far removed for a comparison. I don't think 1992 is. It may be,
but I doubt it.

> Looking at it purely subjectively, the 92 team had the best player in
> Jordan, but the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best players come from the 08 team
> (James, Bryant and Wade in some permutation).

Holy shit.... did you just claim Wade to be the FOURTH BEST player of the
'92 and '08 teams? He's not the 4th best player on the current Olympic
team. He's o FAR overshadowed by MOST of the '92 team. Wow. You're so far
out in left field you just found the parking lot.

> The worst player is, by far, Laettner on the 92 team

Yes.

> (not his fault, they wanted a college guy and did not take Shaq for
> whatever reason). Each team had a fading superstar (Johnson, Kidd) and
> the 92 team had a finished superstar (Bird).

And that's so typical. He played his role very well and the current team
would do well to have more guys like him....older, smart, winner, good
shooter ... repeat, GOOD SHOOTER... as opposed to the brick layers we have
now.

> As the 08 team looks a little stronger at the top and bottom of the
> roster, the 92 team looks a little stronger in the middle of the roster.

Uh, no. Lebron and Kobe (yes, I'll give you him) are great enough to be
talked about as Dream Team level of talent. Maybe Kidd, but there's no way
in hell Kidd displaces Stockton or Magic. That's it.

> Each team has about 10 Hall of Fame caliber players in various stages of
> their careers.
>
> The more you look at it, the only advantage the 92 team really has is
> experience, in particular championship experience, and I think that is
> just enough to justify calling them the better team. But it is
> excruciatingly close, most of the argument in shallower waters such as
> Usenet and popular message boards comes down to an appeal to Good Old Days
> Syndrome.

It may be. But that's for a reason. It was the good old days because the
players were more talented. Not as athletic, but better overall. And yes,
they played vastly superior team basketball 15 years ago. And yes, the
Dream Team was a much better TEAM. Yes, part of that was because of
age/experience, but the rest was simply because of a different culture of
basketball - one based more on fundamentals, shooting, passing, and
understanding your place on a team. Today it's about isolation, alley-oops,
and Nike logos.

<lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1e126264-c25b-41f0-86ce-eb4f03116489@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...

kobe has proven that at any time he can score 50 points.

*************************************************8

Actually, Boston has proven that at any point Kobe can be made impotent and
his team can be crushed. If your statement were true, LA would have
actually contended for a championship last year rather than spectated during
it.

kenzaburo <James.B.Reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in news:fb46850c-b5fe-498e-8de3-
010a4f26d043@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:

> On Aug 12, 4:41 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >"kenzaburo" <James.B.Reyno...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:999204d5-bee3-4a71-8d28-
>> >But at least it's an attempt to be subjective, as opposed to the
>> >"Jordan/Bird/Magic rulezz, Lebron/Kobe/Wade suckz!!1!"
>>
>> I only said Kobe sucks.  Lebron and Wade are the only two players in th
> e
>> current Olympic squad that could have played on the 1992 squad.
>
> Again, I can't take this seriously. Do you really think that Christian
> Laettner > Kobe Bryant? If you tell me it's because of your deep-
> rooted Boston hatred of all things Laker, I can go along with that...
> But subjectively, you really think that Kobe Bryant couldn't have
> played on the 92 team over Chris Mullin? Or a 36 year old Larry Bird?
>

I only hate the teams I fear...everyone fears the Lakers even in off
years...not so with the c's...didn't even know what there record was last
year other than it was bad...

Bryant Durrell wrote:
> In article <g7ssn001c67@news1.newsguy.com>,
> Robert Chin <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> <lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>
> Point 2: KG and Ray have gold medals.

An argument why they shouldn't care much about the upcoming NBA season, odd
coming from you!

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Those who get their news from the New York Times will be left
wondering why on earth Edwards is on television confessing to an
affair." -- Paul Mirengoff

lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>
> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.

No, he just did not try out. He would have made the team as a backup big
in the Bosh mold, and probably been better than Bosh some of the time (but
not today).

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Those who get their news from the New York Times will be left
wondering why on earth Edwards is on television confessing to an
affair." -- Paul Mirengoff

Alson Wong wrote:

> The '92 had a substantial edge in bigs.

Indeed. And the '08 team has a substantial advantage on the perimeter.

Going a bit further, the '92 team had an advantage in half court offense,
the '08 team on defense and in transition.

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"Those who get their news from the New York Times will be left
wondering why on earth Edwards is on television confessing to an
affair." -- Paul Mirengoff

In article <g81kd9$l4n$2@registered.motzarella.org>,
Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>Bryant Durrell wrote:
>> In article <g7ssn001c67@news1.newsguy.com>,
>> Robert Chin <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> <lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>
>> Point 2: KG and Ray have gold medals.
>
>An argument why they shouldn't care much about the upcoming NBA season, odd
>coming from you!

Tch. It's an argument that they're good enough to make the team. I
mean, I shouldn't have engaged; it's ludicrous to say that KG couldn't
have made the team. (Ray Allen -- maybe. Good enough but I can't argue
that he's one of the best candidates at his position. Pierce -- he
could certainly make the team on skill, but is still reaping the rewards
of his previous stint.)

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

In article <g81kfc$l4n$3@registered.motzarella.org>,
Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
>> On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>
>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>
>> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
>> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.
>
>No, he just did not try out. He would have made the team as a backup big
>in the Bosh mold, and probably been better than Bosh some of the time (but
>not today).

Starting Carmelo at PF confuses me. Then again, starting Kidd at PG also
confuses me.

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

Bryant Durrell wrote:

(Ray Allen -- maybe. Good enough but I can't
> argue that he's one of the best candidates at his position. )


For the situation and that team, Ray Allen was the leader and the one that
got the US their last Gold...
Took him half a season to recover since they did not get back from OZ until
training camp.


--
Laurel T
"Superstar- A player who hears what he
doesn't want to hear, sees what he doesn't
want to see, and does what he doesn't want to do"
-Unknown

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g81kj9$l4n$4@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> Indeed. And the '08 team has a substantial advantage on the perimeter.

Maybe if you consider overall depth, but not if you look at just the top '92
perimeter players (Stockton, Jordan, Pippen). In a actual high-stakes game
against the '08 team, those three guys probably would get 30-plus minutes
apiece. Paul, Kobe, and LeBron wouldn't have a substantial edge against
them, IMO. Man, wouldn't those be great matchups to see? Stockton vs. Paul,
Jordan vs. Kobe, Pippen vs. LeBron.

> Going a bit further, the '92 team had an advantage in half court offense,
> the '08 team on defense and in transition.

See above. Tough to put together a better group of perimeter defenders than
Stockton, Jordan, and Pippen, with Ewing/Robinson and Malone backing them up
inside.

"Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g81kj9$l4n$4@registered.motzarella.org...
> Alson Wong wrote:
>
>> The '92 had a substantial edge in bigs.

undeniable.

> Indeed. And the '08 team has a substantial advantage on the perimeter.

undeniably false.

> Going a bit further, the '92 team had an advantage in half court offense,

yes

> the '08 team on defense and in transition.

no. You're confusing speed with transition.

Alson Wong wrote:
> "Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
> news:g81kj9$l4n$4@registered.motzarella.org...
>>
>> Indeed. And the '08 team has a substantial advantage on the
>> perimeter.
>
> Maybe if you consider overall depth, but not if you look at just the
> top '92 perimeter players (Stockton, Jordan, Pippen). In a actual
> high-stakes game against the '08 team, those three guys probably
> would get 30-plus minutes apiece. Paul, Kobe, and LeBron wouldn't
> have a substantial edge against them, IMO. Man, wouldn't those be
> great matchups to see? Stockton vs. Paul, Jordan vs. Kobe, Pippen vs.
> LeBron.

What happened to Clyde?

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6gkafbFgdge8U1@mid.individual.net...
>
> What happened to Clyde?

I actually had him listed when I wrote the message originally, but trimmed
him out. If you were coaching a team that had both him and Jordan, would you
split their playing time or give Jordan the lion's share of the minutes?

Alson Wong wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:6gkafbFgdge8U1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> What happened to Clyde?
>
> I actually had him listed when I wrote the message originally, but
> trimmed him out. If you were coaching a team that had both him and
> Jordan, would you split their playing time or give Jordan the lion's
> share of the minutes?

I would not have Clyde DNP-CD... =)

Put them in together. Run Pippen at point part of the time.
How about that perimeter matchup?...Pip on CP3, Clyde on Kobe and MJ on
LeBron...
CP3 might get past Pip with the speed (as he would have Stockton) but as you
noted the interior defense was not shabby...
And better at the other end. LBJ is overmatched, Kobe has his hands full
with Clyde and Pip can just shoot over CP3.



--
Laurel T
"Superstar- A player who hears what he
doesn't want to hear, sees what he doesn't
want to see, and does what he doesn't want to do"
-Unknown

"Alson Wong" <rasvp@yahoo.com._b_l_o_c_k_> wrote in message
news:bw7pk.2731$dB6.2677@newsfe01.iad...
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:6gkafbFgdge8U1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> What happened to Clyde?
>
> I actually had him listed when I wrote the message originally, but trimmed
> him out. If you were coaching a team that had both him and Jordan, would
> you split their playing time or give Jordan the lion's share of the
> minutes?

In the Olympics when every game was a non-contest joke? I'd split. In a
tough competition? I'd give more minutes to MJ but Clyde could also be
played alongside Jordan as bother had versatility to play forward or guard.

"Skeptic" <bcs002b@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Ummpk.299559$yE1.76500@attbi_s21...
>
> In the Olympics when every game was a non-contest joke? I'd split. In a
> tough competition? I'd give more minutes to MJ but Clyde could also be
> played alongside Jordan as bother had versatility to play forward or
> guard.

The original discussion was '92 USA vs. '08 USA, so that'd be tough
competition. Drexler and Jordan could play at three, but they'd give up some
size and strength against LeBron. Pippen would be a better matchup, at least
defensively, against him.

Bryant Durrell wrote:
> In article <g81kd9$l4n$2@registered.motzarella.org>,
> Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>> Bryant Durrell wrote:
>>> In article <g7ssn001c67@news1.newsguy.com>,
>>> Robert Chin <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> <lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>> Point 2: KG and Ray have gold medals.
>> An argument why they shouldn't care much about the upcoming NBA season, odd
>> coming from you!
>
> Tch. It's an argument that they're good enough to make the team. I
> mean, I shouldn't have engaged; it's ludicrous to say that KG couldn't
> have made the team. (Ray Allen -- maybe. Good enough but I can't argue
> that he's one of the best candidates at his position. Pierce -- he
> could certainly make the team on skill, but is still reaping the rewards
> of his previous stint.)

In all seriousness:

KG makes the team as first backup big off the bench (cutting Bosh's minutes)

Pierce makes it to the final one or two cuts, but not quite good enough to
make the team with so many better wing options available

Allen would really have no business on the team as far as quality, he's an
average NBA player these days, but if they decided to carry a pure shooting
specialist he would be in the running for it along with the Barrys and
Kaponos of the world...err the country.

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"The world oil shortage is political, not geological."
-- Jon Utley on drilling in ANWR

Bryant Durrell wrote:
> In article <g81kfc$l4n$3@registered.motzarella.org>,
> Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>> lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
>>> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.
>> No, he just did not try out. He would have made the team as a backup big
>> in the Bosh mold, and probably been better than Bosh some of the time (but
>> not today).
>
> Starting Carmelo at PF confuses me. Then again, starting Kidd at PG also
> confuses me.

I'm a little surprised they don't put LeBron at 4, then again Carmelo has
been a great international player in the past (not so much this time) and
whatever they're doing seems to be working out ok...

I'd start Paul as well, but Kidd for five minutes early is ok.

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"The world oil shortage is political, not geological."
-- Jon Utley on drilling in ANWR

In article <g873ro$v0l$2@registered.motzarella.org>,
Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>Bryant Durrell wrote:
>> In article <g81kfc$l4n$3@registered.motzarella.org>,
>> Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>>> lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
>>>> On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>
>>>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>
>>>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>>> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
>>>> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.
>>> No, he just did not try out. He would have made the team as a backup big
>>> in the Bosh mold, and probably been better than Bosh some of the time (but
>>> not today).
>>
>> Starting Carmelo at PF confuses me. Then again, starting Kidd at PG also
>> confuses me.
>
>I'm a little surprised they don't put LeBron at 4, then again Carmelo has
>been a great international player in the past (not so much this time) and
>whatever they're doing seems to be working out ok...
>
>I'd start Paul as well, but Kidd for five minutes early is ok.

LeBron is insane this year. Can both Lakers and Celtics fans pause a moment
to give thanks that he's never had a really good supporting cast?

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

Bryant Durrell wrote:
> In article <g873ro$v0l$2@registered.motzarella.org>,
> Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>> Bryant Durrell wrote:
>>> In article <g81kfc$l4n$3@registered.motzarella.org>,
>>> Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>>>> lakerswin2009@yahoo.com wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 12, 1:44 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>> <lakerswin2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>
>>>>>> news:fa5f4ff1-a44c-4714-aea8-a6403cbbcde7@s1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> great points. but most already knew that. the only reason the smelts
>>>>>>> fans are trying to put down this dream team is because none of their
>>>>>>> mercenaries were good enough to make the team.
>>>>>> Point1: KG refused to play because he wanted to focus on winning with the
>>>>>> C's. Mission accomplished, beeeeauch.
>>>>> hey dumbnuts the regular season ended before the dream team started.
>>>>> the fact is he wasn't good enough to make the team.
>>>> No, he just did not try out. He would have made the team as a backup big
>>>> in the Bosh mold, and probably been better than Bosh some of the time (but
>>>> not today).
>>> Starting Carmelo at PF confuses me. Then again, starting Kidd at PG also
>>> confuses me.
>> I'm a little surprised they don't put LeBron at 4, then again Carmelo has
>> been a great international player in the past (not so much this time) and
>> whatever they're doing seems to be working out ok...
>>
>> I'd start Paul as well, but Kidd for five minutes early is ok.
>
> LeBron is insane this year. Can both Lakers and Celtics fans pause a moment
> to give thanks that he's never had a really good supporting cast?

I'm glad enough he's not in the West :)

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"The world oil shortage is political, not geological."
-- Jon Utley on drilling in ANWR

Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:g873nv$v0l$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>
> In all seriousness:
>
> KG makes the team as first backup big off the bench (cutting Bosh's
> minutes)

You must be drinking that Kook flavored Kool Aid. KG would start ahead of
Dwight Howard. Howard has been lost and/or under utilized in the Olympics.
KG would know what to do.

"Bryant Durrell" <durrell@innocence.com> wrote in message
news:ZOmdndecPrNWhDrVnZ2dnUVZ_u6dnZ2d@supernews.com...
>
> LeBron is insane this year. Can both Lakers and Celtics fans pause a
> moment
> to give thanks that he's never had a really good supporting cast?

Ummm...as an experienced and knowledgeable Celtic AND NBA fan, I've been
giving Lebron his props through out. I hope Danny Ainge is plotting a way
to snatch out from under Jay Z in a couple of years. The Cavs roster was
infinitely more horrible that the Lakers the past couple of years. Yet
there was Lebron carrying them to the NBA Finals and the EC Semis in
consecutive years. Without Lebron and the Cavs are a 15 win team.

Let the Lebron and Kobe switch teams and here's what happens. Lebron MIGHT
be getting a ring in a couple of months and the Cavs would have been
watching the playoffs instead of almost beating the C's.

Only a casual or LA fan (I supposed they are the same) buys that "Kobe is
the best" nonsense. How can he be the "best player in the world" if he
wasn't the best in the playoffs, and isn't the best on the Team USA? Lebron
is the best. the C's needed a team if legitmate NBA all stars, one of whom
should have been the past seasons MVP to beat Lebron and the hapless Cavs.

In article <g885730hmq@news1.newsguy.com>,
Robert Chin <bchin_us@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Gary Collard" <dm@ddd.com> wrote in message
>news:g873nv$v0l$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>
>> In all seriousness:
>>
>> KG makes the team as first backup big off the bench (cutting Bosh's
>> minutes)
>
>You must be drinking that Kook flavored Kool Aid. KG would start ahead of
>Dwight Howard. Howard has been lost and/or under utilized in the Olympics.
>KG would know what to do.

I actually wouldn't start KG at center. It's not his position. I will
grant that he doesn't fit in to the existing Team USA scheme, which is
basically a small to mid-sized lineup with Howard cleaning up rebounds.
On the other hand, I have to think that if they had KG available, you'd
see something with Howard, KG, LeBron, Kobe, and Chris Paul.

Then you get a quality smaller second unit with Bosh and Boozer as the
two big men, and Wade as the first scorer off the bench. This is
without hindsight -- given what we've seen so far you swap Kobe and Wade,
since Wade's performing at a very high level. Either way you've got a
really strong sixth man.

Oh, and in half-response to something Gary said earlier -- I'd give Pierce
Jason Kidd's spot.

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

On Aug 16, 8:25 pm, "Robert Chin" <bchin...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Bryant Durrell" <durr...@innocence.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ZOmdndecPrNWhDrVnZ2dnUVZ_u6dnZ2d@supernews.com...
>
>
>
> > LeBron is insane this year.  Can both Lakers and Celtics fans pause a
> > moment
> > to give thanks that he's never had a really good supporting cast?
>
> Ummm...as an experienced and knowledgeable Celtic AND NBA fan, I've been
> giving Lebron his props through out.  I hope Danny Ainge is plotting a way
> to snatch out from under Jay Z in a couple of years.  The Cavs roster was
> infinitely more horrible that the Lakers the past couple of years.  Yet
> there was Lebron carrying them to the NBA Finals and the EC Semis in
> consecutive years.  Without Lebron and the Cavs are a 15 win team.
>
> Let the Lebron and Kobe switch teams and here's what happens.  Lebron MIGHT
> be getting a ring in a couple of months and the Cavs would have been
> watching the playoffs instead of almost beating the C's.
>
> Only a casual or LA fan (I supposed they are the same) buys that "Kobe is
> the best" nonsense.  How can he be the "best player in the world" if he
> wasn't the best in the playoffs, and isn't the best on the Team USA?  

did you watch the regular season at all? you have to be one of the
most moronic posters ever when it comes to baksetball. kobe is playing
team ball for team usa and everyone is getting their time and their
points. your hate is blinding you. nobody in the league carried their
team or played more exciting games than kobe. that is why he is a fan
favorite everywhere he goes. even your smeltics fans were chanting mvp
when he played in your weedy garden. you are the weakest link.
goodbye.

plonk

> <lakerswin2009@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:3c88cfb2-cd07-4100-b545-4df0d9c41095@a8g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>
> did you watch the regular season at all?

Yes. Kobe's play this past season is that same as it has always been. It's
him expecting his teammates to make him look good. He takes whatever bad
shot he wants, defends when he pleases. He gets away with it because his
(fraud) coach is an enabler.

Every sane basketball person knows that the Lakers can not win a
championship the way they are constructed. They have to do something
similar to what the Bulls did when they had MJ. They have to find an
extremely talented 1A who will willingly defer to the egomaniac Kobe. The
problem for the Lakers is that Kobe is no MJ. Whoever they bring in to
"complement" the Kobester has to be a better all around player than the
Kobemaniac.

It sucks to be you...a Kobe jocker.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Bryant Durrell wrote:
> Oh, and in half-response to something Gary said earlier -- I'd give Pierce
> Jason Kidd's spot.

In half reply :)

Pierce is better than Kidd, but he cannot play point, and with the 5 foul
rule you have to have three points I think.

Billups? Kind of old, as is Baron and Miller, but who else is there who's
younger? Ford, Harris?

--
Gary Collard
SABR-L Moderator
gmcollard@yahoo.com
http://sarcastipundit.blogspot.com/

"The world oil shortage is political, not geological."
-- Jon Utley on drilling in ANWR

In article <g8cblo$vv0$1@registered.motzarella.org>,
Gary Collard <dm@ddd.com> wrote:
>Bryant Durrell wrote:
>> Oh, and in half-response to something Gary said earlier -- I'd give Pierce
>> Jason Kidd's spot.
>
>In half reply :)
>
>Pierce is better than Kidd, but he cannot play point, and with the 5 foul
>rule you have to have three points I think.

Oh, that's a good point. (Ho ho ho.) Although in theory you could put
LeBron in there... actually, that's a case for Ray Allen over Michael
Redd as the shooter, since Allen can handle the ball in a pinch. I'm
not sure it's a great case, though.

>Billups? Kind of old, as is Baron and Miller, but who else is there who's
>younger? Ford, Harris?

Yeah, too many of the obvious candidates are foreign. Arenas, if he was
healthy. Or, um, we could hypothetically be intelligent and remember that
Wade averages 6.5 assists per game, so maybe he's a good choice.

--
Bryant Durrell // durrell@innocence.com // durrell@gmail.com

Gary Collard wrote:
> Bryant Durrell wrote:
>> Oh, and in half-response to something Gary said earlier -- I'd give
>> Pierce Jason Kidd's spot.
>
> In half reply :)
>
> Pierce is better than Kidd, but he cannot play point, and with the 5
> foul rule you have to have three points I think.
>
> Billups? Kind of old, as is Baron and Miller, but who else is there
> who's younger? Ford, Harris?

Roy can run the point and play D. And switch to off guard with Williams off
the bench with CPaul starting.
He was invited to the practice team and is said to be in the mix for the
next team.


--
Laurel T
"A good point guard and scorer should go
hand in hand, but not in the locker room."
Frank Layden