...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
be a DISASTER for Paxson? And us?

If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
season.

Time for Reinsdorf / Paxson to go after it and get something done. Don't
worry about the f------ salary cap luxury tax - according to Forbes (or
Fortune or one of those capitalist tools), the Bulls have been the most
profitable NBA team over the past decade.

On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
> ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
> be a DISASTER for Paxson? And us?
>
> If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
> Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
> will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
> season.

Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.

I have no sense of the rhythm of this time of year but I will b sorely
disappointed if the Bulls do not make a trade by Aug 15. They need to
clear the logjam in the backcourt.

On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
(in article
<6e02a23b-a3d7-4db8-b799-390bb90a5c54@a21g2000prf.googlegroups.com>):

> On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
>> ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
>> be a DISASTER for Paxson? And us?
>>
>> If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
>> Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
>> will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
>> season.
>
> Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
> force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
> contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.
>
> I have no sense of the rhythm of this time of year but I will b sorely
> disappointed if the Bulls do not make a trade by Aug 15. They need to
> clear the logjam in the backcourt.

From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably Gordon, too)
for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last year.

Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about Gordon,
and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a productive one.

David wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote

>
> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
> Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
> year.
>
> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about
> Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
> productive one.

They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting for Deng
to sign the QO. =)
Will Deng really gamble again?


--
Laurel T
"It's another one of those things that sort of
gurgles up from the basketball Babylon,"
Petrie on a Trade Rumor
Laurel T

On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 19:57:19 -0500, Terraholm wrote
(in article <6esmnnF8orf6U1@mid.individual.net>):

> David wrote:
>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>
>>
>> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
>> Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
>> year.
>>
>> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about
>> Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
>> productive one.
>
> They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting for Deng
> to sign the QO. =)
> Will Deng really gamble again?
>
>
>

Question is, will the Bulls really gamble again?

I'm actually betting on Deng signing a shorter-term (3 years) contract rather
than taking the QO.

I'm betting on Gordon taking the QO.

David wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
> (in article
> <6e02a23b-a3d7-4db8-b799-390bb90a5c54@a21g2000prf.googlegroups.com>):
>
>> On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
>>> ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
>>> be a DISASTER for Paxson? And us?
>>>
>>> If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
>>> Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
>>> will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
>>> season.
>> Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
>> force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
>> contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.
>>
>> I have no sense of the rhythm of this time of year but I will b sorely
>> disappointed if the Bulls do not make a trade by Aug 15. They need to
>> clear the logjam in the backcourt.
>
> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably Gordon, too)
> for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last year.
>
> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about Gordon,
> and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a productive one.
>
>

I think Deng proved last year that he isn't worth that kind of
money. Given the chance to prove his mettle, he folded like a
house of cards in an earthquake. In almost every measurable stat
he regressed from his 06-07 season. This guy has yet to prove he
is an upper echelon player.

On Jul 24, 7:05 pm, Frank Sereno <fserenonos...@nospamsbcglobal.net>
wrote:
>
> I think Deng proved last year that he isn't worth that kind of
> money. Given the chance to prove his mettle, he folded like a
> house of cards in an earthquake. In almost every measurable stat
> he regressed from his 06-07 season. This guy has yet to prove he
> is an upper echelon player.

Caveat: I pretty much missed last season.

I'm willing to give Deng and Hinrich mulligans on last season -- to
extraploate the arc of the their progress from prior years. Gordon's
game, on the other hand, has always seemed defined by its limitations.

On Jul 24, 3:25 pm, sv0f <varm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
>
> > ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
> > be a DISASTER for Paxson? And us?
>
> > If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
> > Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
> > will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
> > season.
>
> Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
> force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
> contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.
>

If I were Pax, I would do what the Warriors did with Davis. And 8
Million is WAY too high for Gordon who is a one dimensional player.

On Jul 24, 5:57 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> David wrote:
> > On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>
> > From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
> > Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
> > year.
>
> > Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about
> > Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
> > productive one.
>
> They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting for Deng
> to sign the QO. =)
> Will Deng really gamble again?
>
> --
> Laurel T
> "It's another one of those things that sort of
> gurgles up from the basketball Babylon,"
> Petrie on a Trade Rumor
> Laurel T

I'm certain that Portland is NOT the only city with their eyes on
Deng.

Rizzo

On Sat, 26 Jul 2008 23:02:06 -0500, Frank Rizzo wrote
(in article
<055a5530-f484-439d-b0e6-d4ea9bf32d49@r35g2000prm.googlegroups.com>):

> On Jul 24, 5:57 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> David wrote:
>>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>>
>>> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
>>> Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
>>> year.
>>
>>> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about
>>> Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
>>> productive one.
>>
>> They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting for Deng
>> to sign the QO. =)
>> Will Deng really gamble again?
>>
>> --
>> Laurel T
>> "It's another one of those things that sort of
>> gurgles up from the basketball Babylon,"
>> Petrie on a Trade Rumor
>> Laurel T
>
> I'm certain that Portland is NOT the only city with their eyes on
> Deng.
>
> Rizzo

But Portland is the city that will have cap space after next season.

Frank Rizzo wrote:
> On Jul 24, 5:57 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> David wrote:
>>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>>
>>> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
>>> Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
>>> year.
>>
>>> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right
>>> about Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
>>> productive one.
>>
>> They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting
>> for Deng to sign the QO. =)
>> Will Deng really gamble again?
>>
>> --

>
> I'm certain that Portland is NOT the only city with their eyes on
> Deng.

And what other city would be more attractive BBall wise AND be under the cap
by 15 million or more next summer?
However I think he will sign an extension. It seems an awful big gamble not
to even though he dodged the bullet last year.

--
Laurel T
"I hate to do it, but I have to give Smitty
some credit for his defense.
Steve did a nice job of yelling for help every time Cliff
got the ball." DRob

On Jul 26, 9:49 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Frank Rizzo wrote:
> > On Jul 24, 5:57 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> David wrote:
> >>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>
> >>> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably
> >>> Gordon, too) for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last
> >>> year.
>
> >>> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right
> >>> about Gordon, and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a
> >>> productive one.
>
> >> They are playing chicken, portland fans (me included) are rooting
> >> for Deng to sign the QO. =)
> >> Will Deng really gamble again?
>
> >> --
>
> > I'm certain that Portland is NOT the only city with their eyes on
> > Deng.
>
> And what other city would be more attractive BBall wise AND be under the cap
> by 15 million or more next summer?
> However I think he will sign an extension. It seems an awful big gamble not
> to even though he dodged the bullet last year.
>
> --
> Laurel T
> "I hate to do it, but I have to give Smitty
> some credit for his defense.
> Steve did a nice job of yelling for help every time Cliff
> got the ball." DRob

It just depends what he wants. There will be others under the cap
next season.

On Jul 24, 7:55 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
> (in article
> <6e02a23b-a3d7-4db8-b799-390bb90a5...@a21g2000prf.googlegroups.com>):
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
> >> ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going to
> >> be a DISASTER for Paxson?  And us?
>
> >> If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
> >> Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
> >> will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good development
> >> season.
>
> > Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
> > force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
> > contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.
>
> > I have no sense of the rhythm of this time of year but I will b sorely
> > disappointed if the Bulls do not make a trade by Aug 15. They need to
> > clear the logjam in the backcourt.
>
> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably Gordon, too)
> for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last year.
>
> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about Gordon,
> and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a productive one.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Let's look at the SF's in the East: Lebron, Pierce, Butler, Prince,
Turkoglu, Igoduala, Jefferson, Gerald Wallace, maybe Marion. I don't
think Deng really stands out in that crowd. I just don't see him as a
real difference maker.
Could the Bulls win a championship with him as the second best
player ? IMO no. If not, they have to find another star (I'm
assuming Rose is going to be great) and figure out how much to pay the
third wheel.

On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 07:30:31 -0500, cowznofsky wrote
(in article
<0f8d40b5-afc3-41b1-9430-06e6c956185d@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>):

> On Jul 24, 7:55 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:25:06 -0500, sv0f wrote
>> (in article
>> <6e02a23b-a3d7-4db8-b799-390bb90a5...@a21g2000prf.googlegroups.com>):
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Jul 23, 8:53 pm, David <david...@attbi.com> wrote:
>>>> ...that except for the luck of the ping pong balls, this summer is going
>>>> to
>>>> be a DISASTER for Paxson?  And us?
>>
>>>> If something long term doesn't get done with Gordon and Deng (particularly
>>>> Deng) - sign or sign and trade - and they sign qualifying offers, nothing
>>>> will have been accomplished and next season won't even be a good
>>>> development
>>>> season.
>>
>>> Agreed. My preference is that the Bulls sign Deng (10 mil a year) and
>>> force Gordon to make a hard choice between a low-ball, short-term
>>> contract (8 mil a year for 3 years) and the QO.
>>
>>> I have no sense of the rhythm of this time of year but I will b sorely
>>> disappointed if the Bulls do not make a trade by Aug 15. They need to
>>> clear the logjam in the backcourt.
>>
>> From what I read, they seem to be low-balling Deng (and probably Gordon,
>> too)
>> for less than the $57.5 / 5 years they offered him last year.
>>
>> Now is not the time to low-ball - get Deng signed, you're right about
>> Gordon,
>> and do whatever necessary to make this coming season a productive one.-
>> Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Let's look at the SF's in the East: Lebron, Pierce, Butler, Prince,
> Turkoglu, Igoduala, Jefferson, Gerald Wallace, maybe Marion. I don't
> think Deng really stands out in that crowd. I just don't see him as a
> real difference maker.
> Could the Bulls win a championship with him as the second best
> player ? IMO no. If not, they have to find another star (I'm
> assuming Rose is going to be great) and figure out how much to pay the
> third wheel.

Point is, you can't keep starting over - if you want to trade him (and
Gordon), trade him (them) - just don't let them sign the QO knowing they'll
probably be gone after next year, which means you've built nothing this year.
Paxson has to make something happen to move this team along - so far, he has
not proven that he can do other than eliminate problem-children for next to
nothing (or, maybe, worse, in taking back Hughes' contract) - his draft picks
haven't proven out, he has not made a trade that significantly improved the
team, he hasn't hired a coach that has proven out.

Great opportunity this season, with a potential superstar coming on board who
has to have a stable team to learn with.

I can "wait until next year" to see win/loss results - don't even care (much)
whether or not they make the playoffs, let alone go deep - must see progress
now.

What if Deng & Gordon both sign qualifying offers and have worse
seasons than they did last year ? Then we will know it wasn't a fluke,
a one time lapse in judgement, these guys will have proven in
consecutive years that they are too dumb to claim a shitload of
millions that keeps shrinking.