I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city. The owner has
ties to Oklahoma. He can capture the entire attention of a city that does
not have a pro sports team...

However, if I were an owner. I would take my chances in St. Louis. I think
St. Louis can handle a basketball team.

The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.

The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2 million.

St Louis has an urban community that would constantly provide for the
team... I can only see Oklahoman's keeping their eye on OSU and OU sports.

If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5 years.

--
____

--Boycotting the 2008 China Olympic Games--

Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.

So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of here is a plus


> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
> million.

But here is a minus? =)


> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> years.

Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.


--
Laurel T
"If Jordan loves the game so much,
why does he keep quitting?"
Cal Ripken

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>
> So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of here is a plus
>
>
>> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>>
>> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
>> million.
>
> But here is a minus? =)
>
>
>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>> years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will
> be a state wide market.

not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...

bozak wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message


>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...

NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.


--
Laurel T
Frank Layden on a 60-foot Maurice Lucas shot that
sent a game into overtime:
"In most places he would have won a car
or a trip to Hawaii. All he got was a tie."

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...

>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>> years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.

San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2 million
people.. plus tons of college students.

Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't think
Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.

SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million people...
That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the north). Also,
SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business city in the
country right now... which means patrons.

Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
City area which has 1.2 million citizens...

Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on basketball
games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think OKC can
afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with other NBA
teams?

I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
> bozak wrote:
>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>
>>>
>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>
>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>
> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.

i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which also
brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game every
now and then...

bozak wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>> bozak wrote:
>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>
>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>
>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those
>> markets.
>
> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is
> within a close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify
> with...
> which also brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional
> game
> every now and then...

That works....

" bozak" <________bozak1@gmail.com________> wrote in message
news:bWuSj.8196$zw6.5828@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>> bozak wrote:
>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>
>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>
>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.
>
> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
> close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which
> also
> brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game every
> now and then...

Springfield, Missouri is 300 miles from Oklahoma City... Springfield is an
equal distance from St Louis.

Amarillo, Texas is 260 miles from Oklahoma City...

Wichita is 160 miles...

Count maybe 10 people at most who would travel that far to see a team that
they were unfamiliar with.... or yet alone who could afford the occasional
drive and good enough tickets (worth it) to see the team play. People from
two cities would have to stay over night, and the third city would be a 2
and half to 3 hour trip back home.

By those standards... Oklahoma Cities population could just as well drive to
Dallas and watch the Mavs play. Just does not work that way.

Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in
>>> 5 years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
> million people.. plus tons of college students.

It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and suceeded. And
Texas has two other teams.

>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
> think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.

Have to stretch it to Salem...

>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
> people...

SLC area is 1.2 mil.

>That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to
> the north).

The Wasatch front inluding those towns 40 miles to each is 1.8 mil.
http://www.saltlakecityutah.org/aboutsaltlake.htm

The entire state is 2.7 mil... OK has 3.7


>
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
> basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner
> think OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can
> compete with other NBA teams?
>

They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to upgrade it.
They had good attendence for the Hornets and the NBA does not approve a move
unless they have a good percentage of season tickets committed.

> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

Other teams will become available. OKC already had a test drive.


--
Laurel T
When rats leave a sinking ship,
where exactly do they think they're going?"
- Douglas Gauck

" bozak" <________bozak1@gmail.com________> wrote in message
news:fFuSj.8192$zw6.6349@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>>> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>>
>> So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of here is a plus
>>
>>
>>> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>>>
>>> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
>>> million.
>>
>> But here is a minus? =)
>>
>>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>>> years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...

Northwest Arkansas too (about a half million people), even Little Rock area
(almost a million people) and KC (2 million) if you *really* push it...

brink

"Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1@Earth71.net> wrote in message
news:N0wSj.9629$PY5.1385@trnddc01...
>
> " bozak" <________bozak1@gmail.com________> wrote in message
> news:bWuSj.8196$zw6.5828@trnddc06...
>>
>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:67vbirF2r4p6fU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> bozak wrote:
>>>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>>>
>>>> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...
>>>
>>> NBA will likely not let them have TV rights in any or all those markets.
>>
>> i wasnt talking about tv rights... im talking about the arena is within a
>> close enough distance for fans of those cities to identify with... which
>> also
>> brings forth sales of plenty team merchandise and an occasional game
>> every
>> now and then...
>
> Springfield, Missouri is 300 miles from Oklahoma City... Springfield is an
> equal distance from St Louis.
>
> Amarillo, Texas is 260 miles from Oklahoma City...
>
> Wichita is 160 miles...
>
> Count maybe 10 people at most who would travel that far to see a team that
> they were unfamiliar with.... or yet alone who could afford the occasional
> drive and good enough tickets (worth it) to see the team play. People from
> two cities would have to stay over night, and the third city would be a 2
> and half to 3 hour trip back home.
>
> By those standards... Oklahoma Cities population could just as well drive
> to Dallas and watch the Mavs play. Just does not work that way.

Sure it does and it's not necessarily about getting those people into the
arena (though I'm sure they'll have their share of out-of-town bball fans at
each game)... it's about getting the people in a bigger region to support
the team through TV, merch, internet, etc... all of which of course means
more money for the team.

OKC would be the closest team for all those markets listed above plus KC and
NW Arkansas... the trick is to figure out how to market the team in those
areas... baseball often does a good job of this by placing affiliated minor
league teams in markets... the Chicago Cubs have their AAA affiliate in Des
Moines which is a big reason why most of Iowa is considered "Cubs Country"
rather than "Twins Country."

The Lakers have done similar things by playing exhibition games in
Bakersfield, San Diego, and Las Vegas... they claim "ownership" of those
out-of-town markets by building an actual presence there.

Let's see if the OKC management is sharp enough to pull something like that
off...

brink

"Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1@Earth71.net> wrote in message
news:MOuSj.8194$zw6.7314@trnddc06...
>
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>>> years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
> million people.. plus tons of college students.
>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
> think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
> people... That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the
> north). Also, SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business
> city in the country right now... which means patrons.
>
> Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
> City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
> basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think
> OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with
> other NBA teams?

They already have a new arena!

>
> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

Why? No facility in place, there doesn't seem to be a great demand for
it...

Look, I'm not arguing that OKC is a *great* place for a team (it really
isn't and it could very well be a Memphis or New Orleans redux)... just
that it's more complicated than "find the biggest metro area unserved by NBA
basketball"...

If *that* were the formula, the NFL would have had a team in LA 10 years
ago!

brink

"Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vhf4F2q6fhsU2@mid.individual.net...
> It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and suceeded. And
> Texas has two other teams.

Sure... back when the ABA existed and when basketball games were affordable
and where small time business men could invest in them.


> They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to upgrade it.
> They had good attendence for the Hornets and the NBA does not approve a
> move unless they have a good percentage of season tickets committed.

Yeah, but the Hornets thing could have been a flash in the pan. I mean, its
worth a try, but expect an owner to be looking for an arena deal. Owners can
make huge profits with a city that is willing to pay for a 300+ million
dollar arena... The Ford center cost 89 million...The owner may very well
just be using OKC as a layover... It's possible. I still guess 5 years.. but
I don't mind if it works... I mean.. I would be one of the few who would
actually drive to OKC to see the Mavs play there, but only because I know
some people there and would have free places to stay.

On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> > years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.

Cept that Portland's metro population is twice the size of OKC

"brink" <brinknospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vkqpF2nqc1aU2@mid.individual.net...
> Sure it does and it's not necessarily about getting those people into the
> arena (though I'm sure they'll have their share of out-of-town bball fans
> at each game)... it's about getting the people in a bigger region to
> support the team through TV, merch, internet, etc... all of which of
> course means more money for the team.

Indeed, those things count. I am just saying I would go for a larger and
more sure market like St. Louis. After talking to Laurell, I think that OKC
is worth the gamble. Assuming it does not work out in the first 5 years or
so, then the owner can move to a city willing to pay for a brand spanking
new mega arena, like St. Louis.

>
> OKC would be the closest team for all those markets listed above plus KC
> and NW Arkansas... the trick is to figure out how to market the team in
> those areas... baseball often does a good job of this by placing
> affiliated minor league teams in markets... the Chicago Cubs have their
> AAA affiliate in Des Moines which is a big reason why most of Iowa is
> considered "Cubs Country" rather than "Twins Country."
>
> The Lakers have done similar things by playing exhibition games in
> Bakersfield, San Diego, and Las Vegas... they claim "ownership" of those
> out-of-town markets by building an actual presence there.
>
> Let's see if the OKC management is sharp enough to pull something like
> that off...
>
> brink

"brink" <brinknospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:67vkqpF2nqc1aU3@mid.individual.net...
> Why? No facility in place, there doesn't seem to be a great demand for
> it...

Precisely... Anytime an owner gets an arena deal... he maximizes his
wallet...

Maybe this owner is just a true blooded Oklahoman and wants to bring a team
to OKC. That's cool... But if he is in it for the bucks, then he probablly
will not rest with a 85 million dollar arena... If he can get a city to pay
for a 300 million dollar arena... with a contract to keep the team in that
city for 40 years... then he can turn around and sell the team and pocket
the rest...

He may be a Jerry Jonesish type owner though. Jerry got 325 million to build
the new Cowboys stadium... and then put 1 billion of his own money in to
it... I think Jerry generally just loves his team...



>
> Look, I'm not arguing that OKC is a *great* place for a team (it really
> isn't and it could very well be a Memphis or New Orleans redux)... just
> that it's more complicated than "find the biggest metro area unserved by
> NBA basketball"...
>
> If *that* were the formula, the NFL would have had a team in LA 10 years
> ago!
>
> brink

"Blazer Fan Dan" <BlazerFanDan@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:e9575a4d-62fe-484d-a952-aaf81d7e83b7@t12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> > If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>> > years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio.
>> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> Cept that Portland's metro population is twice the size of OKC


Off topic... I love Portland. Great city.

On May 1, 9:04 pm, " bozak" <________boz...@gmail.com________>
wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
> > Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> >> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>
> > So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of  here is a plus
>
> >> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> >> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
> >> million.
>
> > But here is a minus? =)
>
> >> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >> years.
>
> > Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will
> > be a state wide market.
>
> not to mention wichita, amarillo, and springfield mo...- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

yeahhh, wichita!!

Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:67vhf4F2q6fhsU2@mid.individual.net...
>> It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and
>> succeeded. And Texas has two other teams.
>
> Sure... back when the ABA existed and when basketball games were
> affordable and where small time business men could invest in them.


Nope... in the last 10 years when they were campaigning for and got a new
arena. With the help of Clay Bennett the new owner of the sonics that was a
spurs partner at that time.
They were the next smallest market to SLC.

>
>
>> They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to
>> upgrade it. They had good attendance for the Hornets and the NBA
>> does not approve a move unless they have a good percentage of season
>> tickets committed.
>
> Yeah, but the Hornets thing could have been a flash in the pan. I
> mean, its worth a try, but expect an owner to be looking for an arena
> deal. Owners can make huge profits with a city that is willing to pay
> for a 300+ million dollar arena...

No one had a better arena deal than the Hornets in NOLA when they moved
there into an existing arena that needed an upgrade. NOLA even after katrina
is still jumping though hoops for him... low overhead can create increased
profit as much as increasing revenue...looks like they are staying another
ten years with the deal Shinn is negotiating now.

>The Ford center cost 89
> million...

And the people of OKC just voted for a penny sales tax for 100 mil in
improvements and to build a 20 mil practice facility.

>The owner may very well just be using OKC as a layover...

Bennett was the one that rescued the Hornets. This group of owners he put
together was just thrilled with having an NBA team in OKC and wanted the
Hornets to stay and tried to buy them. When Stern and Shinn let it known
that would not happen they went out and bought a team to bring home. There
was never any intention to leave the team in Seattle. Check out the emails
coming out in Schultz's law suit to try to null the sale.

> It's possible. I still guess 5 years.. but I don't mind if it
> works... I mean.. I would be one of the few who would actually drive
> to OKC to see the Mavs play there, but only because I know some
> people there and would have free places to stay.

The NBA committee has been researching it for a year so I suspect they have
a pretty good handle on the support and prospects for the team in OKC.

Louisville IIRC bided for the last expansion team and lost in the board
voting?


--
Laurel T
“On the bright side, if your team sucks
it might as well be in Miami.” Barkley

brink wrote:
> "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1@Earth71.net> wrote in message
> news:MOuSj.8194$zw6.7314@trnddc06...
>>
>> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAMNOT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure
>>>> with-in 5 years.
>>>
>>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>>
>> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
>> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
>> million people.. plus tons of college students.
>>
>> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
>> think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>>
>> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
>> people... That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to
>> the north). Also, SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing
>> business city in the country right now... which means patrons.
>>
>> Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the
>> Oklahoma City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
>> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
>> basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner
>> think OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can
>> compete with other NBA teams?
>
> They already have a new arena!
>
>>
>> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.
>
> Why? No facility in place, there doesn't seem to be a great demand
> for it...

Not in place but might be by the 2010-11 season when right now the sonics
can officially move. They have a new 250 mil arena being built downtown as
nice as many NBA ones for seating, advertising, restaurants, and luxury
suites... but UofL I think has an exclusive lease as the anchor tenant.


--
Laurel T
A coach after being informed, that like
players, their drug tests would include
banned performance enhancing drugs:
"Does that include Viagra?"

Blazer Fan Dan wrote:
> On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in
>>> 5 years.
>>
>> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
>> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> Cept that Portland's metro population is twice the size of OKC

For a current TV market of 400K...

On May 1, 6:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city. The owner has
> ties to Oklahoma. He can capture the entire attention of a city that does
> not have a pro sports team...
>
> However, if I were an owner. I would take my chances in St. Louis. I think
> St. Louis can handle a basketball team.
>
> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2 million.
>
> St Louis has an urban community that would constantly provide for the
> team... I can only see Oklahoman's keeping their eye on OSU and OU sports.
>
> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5 years.
>


They already have an arena built. That's a big deal right there.

On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>
> > I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city.
>
> So going from a city of 3 mil to a smaller market of  here is a plus
>
> > The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> > The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2
> > million.
>
> But here is a minus? =)
>
> > If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> > years.
>
> Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.

And Sacto.


>
> --
> Laurel T
> "If Jordan loves the game so much,
> why does he keep quitting?"
> Cal Ripken

On May 1, 7:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> >> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >> years.
>
> > Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> > And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2 million
> people.. plus tons of college students.
>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't think
> Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million people....
> That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the north). Also,
> SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business city in the
> country right now... which means patrons.
>
> Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
> City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
>
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on basketball
> games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think OKC can
> afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with other NBA
> teams?


They already have an arena. Remember when NO has to move out after
Katrina? They played in OKC.


>
> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city. The owner has
> ties to Oklahoma. He can capture the entire attention of a city that does
> not have a pro sports team...
>
> However, if I were an owner. I would take my chances in St. Louis. I think
> St. Louis can handle a basketball team.
>
> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2 million.
>
> St Louis has an urban community that would constantly provide for the
> team... I can only see Oklahoman's keeping their eye on OSU and OU sports.
>
> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5 years.
>

of course St Louis has had NBA and ABA teams in the past with limited
success.

"PeterL" <po.ning@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:70ed173f-3fd6-4d44-bf30-1e975f5923b3@k1g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
On May 1, 6:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
>They already have an arena built. That's a big deal right there.

Sure, but even if you add 100 million in improvements to that arena, it is
still one of the lowest costing arenas in the league. But it sounds like the
group just wants to keep a team in OKC... and, I don't mind that much. If it
works, it works.

On May 1, 10:17 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> "Blazer Fan Dan" <BlazerFan...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:e9575a4d-62fe-484d-a952-aaf81d7e83b7@t12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On May 1, 6:50 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >> > years.
>
> >> Why? Same size and only pro sports team as Portland, SLC and San
> >> Antonio.
> >> And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> > Cept that Portland's metro population is twice the size of OKC
>
> Off topic... I love Portland. Great city.

I'm partial to it myself.

In article <MOuSj.8194$zw6.7314@trnddc06>,
Don't Taze Me, Bro! <No2Exists1@Earth71.net> wrote:
>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
>>> years.
....
>Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
>City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
....

Having attended 4 NBA games in OKC (the NO-Dal games), I can say from
experience that the city can definitely support an NBA team - and proved
it from the Hornets' temporary stay there (and, remember, the Hornets were
a below .500 team for those 2 years). Those that I talked to at the games
were very excited to have the team and it was a great atmosphere.


>I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

But St. Louis has other professional teams, from which an NBA team would
have to compete with for the residents' entertainment dollars; while OKC
would become a one-sport town, along the lines of San Antonio and Portland
(which show lots of support for their teams, even in down years).


patricia


--
Patricia Bender pbender@eskimo.com
For NBA stuff: http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/index.html
For Mavs stuff: http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/mavs.html

On May 1, 6:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> I can see some reasons why. I mean, its a smaller big city. The owner has
> ties to Oklahoma. He can capture the entire attention of a city that does
> not have a pro sports team...
>
> However, if I were an owner. I would take my chances in St. Louis. I think
> St. Louis can handle a basketball team.
>
> The population of the St. Louis regional area, is roughly 3 million.
>
> The population of the Oklahoma City Regional area, is roughly 1.2 million.
>
> St Louis has an urban community that would constantly provide for the
> team... I can only see Oklahoman's keeping their eye on OSU and OU sports.
>
> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5 years.
>
> --
> ____
>
> --Boycotting the 2008 China Olympic Games--

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I'm always hearing what a great businessman Gay Bennett is. Moving
the Sonics to Oklahoma doesn't rank as good business sense. St.
Louis, or even Kansas City would be better. Best yet would be leaving
the team in Seattle where they have been for 41 years eh!

On May 1, 7:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> >> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >> years.
>
> > Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San Antonio.
> > And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2 million
> people.. plus tons of college students.
>
> Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't think
> Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>
> SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million people....
> That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to the north). Also,
> SLC, according to Forbes, is the fastest growing business city in the
> country right now... which means patrons.
>
> Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
> City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
>
> Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on basketball
> games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner think OKC can
> afford to build them a shiney new arena that can compete with other NBA
> teams?
>
> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

I think Seattle sounds like the best idea.
Seattle, Bellevue, Tacoma, Everett, Olympia, Bremerton, how's that
for market size!

On May 1, 8:51 pm, "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:
>
> > "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:67vab8F2qaifbU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> >>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in
> >>> 5 years.
>
> >> Why? Same size and only pro sports team  as Portland, SLC and San
> >> Antonio. And like Portland and Utah it will be a state wide market.
>
> > San Antonio is the 4th fastest growing city in America with 2 million
> > regional residence. That does not include Austin which has another 2
> > million people.. plus tons of college students.
>
> It was the smallest market in the league for a long time and suceeded. And
> Texas has two other teams.
>
>
>
> > Portland has 2 million people in its metropolitan area... and I don't
> > think Paul Allen would move them if he was losing money.
>
> Have to stretch it to Salem...
>
>
>
> > SLC has the entire Salt Lake Valley... which is about 2.2 million
> > people...
>
> SLC area is 1.2 mil.
>
> >That does not include Provo (to the south) and Ogden (to
> > the north).
>
>  The Wasatch front inluding those towns 40 miles to each is 1.8 mil.http://www.saltlakecityutah.org/aboutsaltlake.htm
>
> The entire state is 2.7 mil... OK  has 3.7
>
>
>
> > Lastly, I cannot see Oklahomans spending a lot of their money on
> > basketball games. The per capita income is 19,098... Does the owner
> > think OKC can afford to build them a shiney new arena that can
> > compete with other NBA teams?
>
> They have an arena and tax support passed by a wide margin to upgrade it.
> They had good attendence for the Hornets and the NBA does not approve a move
> unless they have a good percentage of season tickets committed.
>
> > I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.
>
> Other teams will become available. OKC already had a test drive.
>
> --
> Laurel T
> When rats leave a sinking ship,
> where exactly do they think they're going?"
> - Douglas Gauck

Actually you could say Portlands market stretches to Eugene. And with
the Sonics leaving Seattle the Blazers will gradually win over some
fans in Washington!

On May 2, 4:31 pm, patri...@panix.com (Patricia Bender) wrote:
> In article <MOuSj.8194$zw6.7314@trnddc06>,
> Don't Taze Me, Bro! <No2Exis...@Earth71.net> wrote:>>> If he moves the team to OKC... I predict it to be a failure with-in 5
> >>> years.
> ...
> >Those cities are all growing and have larger populations than the Oklahoma
> >City area which has 1.2 million citizens...
>
> ...
>
> Having attended 4 NBA games in OKC (the NO-Dal games), I can say from
> experience that the city can definitely support an NBA team - and proved
> it from the Hornets' temporary stay there (and, remember, the Hornets were
> a below .500 team for those 2 years).  Those that I talked to at the games
> were very excited to have the team and it was a great atmosphere.
>
> >I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.
>
> But St. Louis has other professional teams, from which an NBA team would
> have to compete with for the residents' entertainment dollars; while OKC
> would become a one-sport town, along the lines of San Antonio and Portland
> (which show lots of support for their teams, even in down years).
>
> patricia
>
> --
>   Patricia Bender                       pben...@eskimo.com
>   For NBA stuff:http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/index.html
>   For Mavs stuff:http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/mavs.html

I think the Hornets were a flash in the pan in OK. People were just
into it because it was new. After the newness wears off then what
happens?

"MACK DADDY" <pepsivanilla@msn.com> wrote in message
news:f22be738-cdd6-4384-8247-a33d91178911@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On May 1, 7:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
wrote:
> "Terraholm" <TerraholmSPAM...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>
> I just think St. Louis sounds like a better bet.

I think Seattle sounds like the best idea.
Seattle, Bellevue, Tacoma, Everett, Olympia, Bremerton, how's that
for market size!

Ah, try Tulsa, Lawton, Wichita, Amarello,Norman,Edmond,Enid,Elk
City,Altus,Chickasha,Duncan and Wichita Falls.

"Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exists1@Earth71.net> wrote in message
news:OTKSj.1248$0L.771@trnddc07...
>
> "PeterL" <po.ning@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:70ed173f-3fd6-4d44-bf30-1e975f5923b3@k1g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 1, 6:15 pm, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!" <No2Exis...@Earth71.net>
> wrote:
>>They already have an arena built. That's a big deal right there.
>
> Sure, but even if you add 100 million in improvements to that arena, it is
> still one of the lowest costing arenas in the league. But it sounds like
> the group just wants to keep a team in OKC... and, I don't mind that much.
> If it works, it works.
>
You ever thought that things in Oklahoma are cheaper then most anywhere else
and thier cheap arena would have cost much more in another city..